19J Lucas CAV DPS Pump Manual needed

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Brianhw

Member
Posts
22
Location
Holywood, Co.Down, Northern Ireland
Hi, This request has possibly been made some time in the dim and distant past but I can find nothing - honest, I've tried hard !
Does anyone know where I can obtain a preferably free manual pdf style download for the above pump, or even decent exploded views ? I can order a conventional manual from ebay but it's £40 or thereabouts - a bit too dear for me !
Any help/guidance on this would be much appreciated - thanks.
 
Brianhw said:
Still looking !
The downloads kindly sent to me by 'flat' are mostly for the DPA pump, while although helpful are not sufficient for me to undertake a complete DPS pump service.
Click to expand...
Don't know what is available on the net, I have hard copies from CAV, but they are rare now. The manuals are interesting, and useful reference when doing minor repairs, but I wouldn't attempt to completely rebuild a pump myself. It isn't as easy as you think, and once you have rebuilt it, it needs to be tested, Which needs an expensive machine. If your motor is very good it may be worth getting the pump rebuilt professionally. If not there shoud be sh pumps about, plenty of 19j have blown up!
 
A "complete service" was maybe a bit of an overstatement - I know that would not be easy or undertaken lightly but I'd really be happy even with knowing what all the gizmos do and how they work, and what adjustments can be made and what effect they have. Nothing beats a manual.
There's one available for free download on the site below but as they ask for bank details I'm too chary to go ahead - have a look and give me your opinion.

http://edoqs.com/lucas-cav-dps-manual



Still hoping .......
 
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Brianhw said:
Come on guys, don't let this thread go cold on me.
Let's have some opinions on the manual download link mentioned above. Is it worth the risk ? Is there any risk ? I NEED this manual !
Click to expand...
Im the last person to ask about it stuff, sounds dodgy to me if its supposed to be free and they want bank details. Cant you just buy one, lot of old manuals are reprinted now. If there is a problem with your pump taking it to a fuel injection place is probably way to go.
 
That's all very well for a well-off gentleman like yourself, Turboman, but £40+ for a manual is a lot to me and maybe double that for the services of a specialist. I much prefer to investigate and fix things myself, rather than just 'farm it out' - a lot of satisfaction is to be gained from successfully sorting something out without external costly help, and also a lot of knowledge to be gained in the process. Q.E.D.

Has anybody else looked at the link above ? More opinions welcomed.
 
Only can find the DPA manual ; https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u...op Manual DPA fuel-injection-pump reduced.pdf

I've heard of the Bosch pump as fitted to TDi's giving good results in place of the Lucas unit on Td's...

Have you thought to look under LDV ? (Sherpa 2.5 NAD engine, which uses basically the same Lucas DPS pump, pulleys etc)... handy if you fancy running more veg oil in the fuel mix :D :cool: and without the LR price hike anorl ...
 
Brianhw said:
That's all very well for a well-off gentleman like yourself, Turboman, but £40+ for a manual is a lot to me and maybe double that for the services of a specialist. I much prefer to investigate and fix things myself, rather than just 'farm it out' - a lot of satisfaction is to be gained from successfully sorting something out without external costly help, and also a lot of knowledge to be gained in the process. Q.E.D.

Has anybody else looked at the link above ? More opinions welcomed.
Click to expand...
Maybe not as well off as some, I try and economise by running old vehicles I can repair myself, but this too has costs with it. Im afraid whatever way you odds it running a landy is going to be dear.
I to prefer too do things for myself, and I do, we rarely use labour on the farm or the house, except for a few contractors for foraging. Just finished working on the kitchen resto now! One area I do make an exception is IPs. Mainly because I have seen so many knackered over the years by the well meaning intentions of owners, and I have seen it done properly, so I have an idea of what is needed.
Simple external leaks and the like are sometimes repairable by a careful owner, if your pump is all worn out, try and source a decent sh one.
 
Thanks, Dippypud' but the DPA pump is a lot different from the DPS. Furthermore, the Sherpa n/a pump does not have the gizmos on it for the turbo, so is not much use either. I don't want to go as far as looking for and trying Bosch pumps belonging to something else, so this option is not on the cards.

In reply to "Turboman" - how do I know if my pump is 'all worn out' if I don't have a manual to tell me what to look for and check ?
Also, by the same reasoning, how would I know what a 'decentish' one was like before going to all the trouble of fitting it and then finding out it wasn't as decent as it was supposed to be ?!
After decades working with all manner of mechanical things, I would not class myself as just a 'well meaning owner'..............

I've chickened out on the idea of looking for a download of a manual as I recently got spyware on my computer searching Googled websites - never again !

It seems I'm on a 'no hoper' with this one, but if anyone at any time comes up with anything I will be extremely pleased.
 
Thanks, Blackburn,
I had just about given up but with your reply, there might still be hope. For now I can't access the link you sent on the Land Rover U.K. forums as I'm not registered with them yet, (I'm on just about every other L/R forum there is !).
To begin with, one thing where there is something not right about my pump is the throttle stop/tick over adjustment - see idle screw adjustment and throttle stop on your other link pic. She ticks over at about the right speed BUT when the throttle is pressed there's a good 1/4 inch gap between the throttle stop adjustment screw and the throttle arm before the revs begin to rise - I have not 'messed' with these settings, (which is not to say the previous owner didn't), although comparing the settings with another pump I have reveals they are roughly similar, but this 'dead gap' cannot be right - surely ? Whether it's relevant or not, she smokes quite badly on a low tick over but clears when the revs are lifted a little.

This is a classic case of where a Manual would probably throw some light on all this.

Anyway, that's my first 'problem' hopefully clearly explained ....

p.s:- The throttle spindle seal is fine - no leaks from there or anywhere else on the pump.
 
Brianhw said:
Thanks, Blackburn,
I had just about given up but with your reply, there might still be hope. For now I can't access the link you sent on the Land Rover U.K. forums as I'm not registered with them yet, (I'm on just about every other L/R forum there is !).
To begin with, one thing where there is something not right about my pump is the throttle stop/tick over adjustment - see idle screw adjustment and throttle stop on your other link pic. She ticks over at about the right speed BUT when the throttle is pressed there's a good 1/4 inch gap between the throttle stop adjustment screw and the throttle arm before the revs begin to rise - I have not 'messed' with these settings, (which is not to say the previous owner didn't), although comparing the settings with another pump I have reveals they are roughly similar, but this 'dead gap' cannot be right - surely ? Whether it's relevant or not, she smokes quite badly on a low tick over but clears when the revs are lifted a little.

This is a classic case of where a Manual would probably throw some light on all this.

Anyway, that's my first 'problem' hopefully clearly explained ....

p.s:- The throttle spindle seal is fine - no leaks from there or anywhere else on the pump.
Click to expand...
I think that is probably normal. I will have a look at mine when its dried up a bit outside. Are there any lockwires or telltale paint on the adjustment screws?
Im afraid a Manual would not help with this. the one I have contains no diagnostic or fault finding info at all. It is purely a list of special tools and the procedures to completely rebuild a pump.
In response to your earlier q. the usual first signs of a pump on its way out are leaks. As Blackburn accurately says, this pump will usually start to leak from the governor housing first. So as your spindle is not leaking it may be a sign that the pump is actually in good health.
 
This is the gist of my post on landrover net and reply

Been busy changing my accelerator linkage as after fitting handthrottle had problems with too rapid acceleration , this turned out to be due to the longer arm I had fitted to accelerator shaft.[made it very difficult to control when you hit a bump]
Anyway as part of the solution I fitted a swivel connector from my spare pump and noticed that the throttle settings where different on the pumps.
Does anyone know what the two adjustments on the throttle plate are for pdf attached showing both pumps and some of info I believe to be correct.
Reply:- The mystery adjusters on the throttle lever are the adjustment of the run down when you shut the throttle.
I will added some more info here which might help .
Cav pump lid.JPG

Cav Pump.jpg

This might also be of help diaphragm failure and repair
http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=33911
Picture of lid shows max fuel adjuster on side if you have too much fuel at tickover might be worth having ago at adjusting this.
Did you say yours was the turbo engine if so the turbo diapragm probably operates in a very similiar way to the Bosch VE pump have a look a this doc might be a case of rotating the diaphragm as in the bosch.
View attachment Bosch VE pump Thermo Guard_Tdi_Tuning_Rev.2.pdf
 
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Thanks for replies.
Firstly, in answer to "Turboman's" questions - no, there's no locking wire except on the maximum throttle stop (and a piece that used to be on the diaphragm cover - see below) and, yes, there's yellow paint on the screw heads but not enough to tell if they've ever been messed with. Although, visually comparing with a spare pump I have shows them to be in about the same positions.
While we're here - do you know what the function of the small arm beneath the main throttle arm does ? Run down ? It has a loose (quite heavy) tension spring on it which only comes into play just before the main throttle arm reaches the fully closed position. Adjustable by one of the yellow screws presumably, but how do I know what the optimum position of this arm should be ?

Secondly, in answer to "Blackburn" - Some weeks ago I found diesel in the pipe from the diaphragm housing on the pump to the turbo which senses pressure when the turbo spins up. I removed the cover in situ and discovered a punctured diaphragm which I replaced with the one out of my spare pump. No further bother. Incidentally, there's no facility for adjusting the diaphragm by rotating as depicted in your Bosch link, so this does not apply in this case. The principle of the diaphragm is the same but not the adjustment.
 
Brian the link to the other forum midway down my last post was actually added at the end don't know how it got to middle,but it details how to adjust plunger on your type of diaphragm.
Lever A in photos is affected by the run down spring and I believ pushes link in my second pic closed you will have to enlarge pics to read added text
 
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Brianhw said:
Thanks for replies.

While we're here - do you know what the function of the small arm beneath the main throttle arm does ? Run down ? It has a loose (quite heavy) tension spring on it which only comes into play just before the main throttle arm reaches the fully closed position. Adjustable by one of the yellow screws presumably, but how do I know what the optimum position of this arm should be ?

Secondly, in answer to "Blackburn" - Some weeks ago I found diesel in the pipe from the diaphragm housing on the pump to the turbo which senses pressure when the turbo spins up. I removed the cover in situ and discovered a punctured diaphragm which I replaced with the one out of my spare pump. No further bother. Incidentally, there's no facility for adjusting the diaphragm
Click to expand...
Looking around for my spare pump, cant find it atm, lots of stuff still out of place from the kitchen rebuild. From memory the only other arm on the governor housing would be a shut off, which is not used as there is a solenoid.
Hope the diaphragm holds, often the fuel will be leaking into the rear chamber and wil split it again, fingers crossed! You are right, it is not adjustable by rotating.
Earlier on you mentioned that I had said you were a well meaning owner. I certainly wasn't dissing your mechanical ability, wasn't even referring to you, just commenting on the fact that I have seen many pumps and other landy stuff made worse by incompetent DIY. I didn't mean to suggest that you were in this group :)
 
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