J

Jim@sea

Member
I am uncertain as to when I should have my Cambelt replaced. (2013 Freelander 2 TD4 41,000 miles ) I heard that it was originally at 10 years beut has been reduced to 7 years
I have been quoted £330 which includes a New Water Pump but not an original Land Rover belt but one made by "Gates" Obviously Land Rover dont have their own cambelt making factory and are Gates their manufacturers ?
 
Up to the 2012/13 face lift, the FL2 had a 10 year, 150,000 miles belt change interval. This was reduced after the facelift, to 7 years 120k? Iirc.

Gates belts are about the best in the business, and is what I've just fitted to my FL2.

Oh and £330 is a pretty good price, compared to how much I've seen others pay for what is effectively a 2 hour job.
 
Nodge68 said:
Up to the 2012/13 face lift, the FL2 had a 10 year, 150,000 miles belt change interval. This was reduced after the facelift, to 7 years 120k? Iirc.

Gates belts are about the best in the business, and is what I've just fitted to my FL2.

Oh and £330 is a pretty good price, compared to how much I've seen others pay for what is effectively a 2 hour job.
Click to expand...
Thanks.
 
The original diesel FL2 had the TD4 engine with 160bhp. FL2 service intervals are measured in 15k mile years. Cambelt change every 10 years or 150k miles, which ever comes first, on the early TD4 with 160bhp.

In 2010 the MY11 model year 2011 vehicles came out with the face lift. The TD4 power dropped from 160 to 150bhp. They also launched the SD4 with 190bhp which is the same engine with a biggerer turbo and things like injectors may be different. They dropped the service interval for cambelt change to 7 years or 105k miles. Reason being the SD4 version had more power so in theory more strain on the cambelt. They also changed the TD4 cambelt service interval to 105k miles or 7 years at the same time.

If it were my FL2... even if it were the earlier pre face lift on the longer service interval... I would still change the cambelt using 7 years or 105k miles, which ever comes first. 10 years (or 150k miles) is a long time (or high mileage) for a rubber belt. I would be wanting to make sure the cambelt was changed in order to reduce risk of failure.

There is a chain inside the diesel engine but that only needs changed if it gets noisy.
 
Hippo said:
The original diesel FL2 had the TD4 engine with 160bhp. FL2 service intervals are measured in 15k mile years. Cambelt change every 10 years or 150k miles, which ever comes first, on the early TD4 with 160bhp.

In 2010 the MY11 model year 2011 vehicles came out with the face lift. The TD4 power dropped from 160 to 150bhp. They also launched the SD4 with 190bhp which is the same engine with a biggerer turbo and things like injectors may be different. They dropped the service interval for cambelt change to 7 years or 105k miles. Reason being the SD4 version had more power so in theory more strain on the cambelt. They also changed the TD4 cambelt service interval to 105k miles or 7 years at the same time.

If it were my FL2... even if it were the earlier pre face lift on the longer service interval... I would still change the cambelt using 7 years or 105k miles, which ever comes first. 10 years (or 150k miles) is a long time (or high mileage) for a rubber belt. I would be wanting to make sure the cambelt was changed in order to reduce risk of failure.

There is a chain inside the diesel engine but that only needs changed if it gets noisy.
Click to expand...

I suspect the belt intervals were reduced to avoid "good will" warranty repair costs when they failed before the 10 year 150k intervals.

The timing belt will be under the same load regardless of TD4 or SD4, as the cams are the same.
The only real difference between the 2 engines are the injectors and turbo, along with the mapping of the ECU.
It's actually possible to use the same 190 Bhp map on the TD4, when it gives just a fraction under 190 Bhp.
 
Nodge68 said:
I suspect the belt intervals were reduced to avoid "good will" warranty repair costs when they failed before the 10 year 150k intervals.

The timing belt will be under the same load regardless of TD4 or SD4, as the cams are the same.
The only real difference between the 2 engines are the injectors and turbo, along with the mapping of the ECU.
It's actually possible to use the same 190 Bhp map on the TD4, when it gives just a fraction under 190 Bhp.
Click to expand...
Even if it's putting more fuel in and/or spinning quicker to develop more power?
Higher power on the smaller turbo would surly put it under more pressure so longevity would be a concern.
They would be well out of warranty, even eggstended used warranty, at 10 years.
The engine performance is set by reading which engine it has fitted using the vin number. So I assume yer talking of over riding this by changing the map?
 
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Hippo said:
Even if it's putting more fuel in and/or spinning quicker to develop more power?
Click to expand...
The power an engine makes doesn't affect the load on the timing belt, as the engine is the same.
I suspect it's more to do with reducing the chances of belt failure, more than engine output.
Hippo said:
Higher power on the smaller turbo would surly put it under more pressure so longevity would be a concern.
Click to expand...
A tiny turbo can make loads of power. However the harder an engine works, the hotter thing like the turbo get. I believe the later turbo was water cooled, which is done to aid long term reliability, as many drivers don't understand how to treat a turbo.
Hippo said:
They would be well out of warranty, even eggstended used warranty, at 10 years.
Click to expand...
Yes they will, but if a low miles belt fails on a 7 year old, full LR history vehicle, the owner will be pretty cross and possibly insist on a partial payment for repairs.
It's easier for LR to reduce the change interval, than get complaints about failing belts.;)
Hippo said:
The engine performance is set by reading which engine it has fitted using the vin number. So I assume yer talking of over riding this by changing the map?
Click to expand...
The fuel maps can be overridden.
I've a spare ECU that SDD reads as HIGH POWER, whereas the standard ECU reads as LOW POWER.
It's not VIN locked at all, at least as far as changes are concerned.
I've just changed the ECU in my FL2, so I could eliminate it as the cause of the misfire.

The VIN in the second hand ECU was overwritten by SDD, to be the same VIN as my FL2. LR said this can't be done, but SDD does it, and without any fuss too.

This appears to be the same for all modules in the vehicle.
 
Nodge68 said:
The power an engine makes doesn't affect the load on the timing belt, as the engine is the same.
I suspect it's more to do with reducing the chances of belt failure, more than engine output.

A tiny turbo can make loads of power. However the harder an engine works, the hotter thing like the turbo get. I believe the later turbo was water cooled, which is done to aid long term reliability, as many drivers don't understand how to treat a turbo.

Yes they will, but if a low miles belt fails on a 7 year old, full LR history vehicle, the owner will be pretty cross and possibly insist on a partial payment for repairs.
It's easier for LR to reduce the change interval, than get complaints about failing belts.;)

The fuel maps can be overridden.
I've a spare ECU that SDD reads as HIGH POWER, whereas the standard ECU reads as LOW POWER.
It's not VIN locked at all, at least as far as changes are concerned.
I've just changed the ECU in my FL2, so I could eliminate it as the cause of the misfire.

The VIN in the second hand ECU was overwritten by SDD, to be the same VIN as my FL2. LR said this can't be done, but SDD does it, and without any fuss too.

This appears to be the same for all modules in the vehicle.
Click to expand...
So in theory you have the ability to change the identity of the vehicle via it's software, not counting the physical vin markers on it. That's a concern.

I can't remember hearing of a FL2 with a snapped timing belt, other than those which have broken because of external damage to normal use.
 
Hippo said:
So in theory you have the ability to change the identity of the vehicle via it's software, not counting the physical vin markers on it. That's a concern.
Click to expand...
Not exactly. SDD allows the VIN of an individual module to be synchronised with the remaining VIN coded modules in the vehicle, the VIN being stored an multiple modules. ;)
Hippo said:
I can't remember hearing of a FL2 with a snapped timing belt, other than those which have broken because of external damage to normal use.
Click to expand...
I've seen a few on ebay with failed timing belts, but crashed ones are much more common.:eek:
 
Nodge68 said:
Not exactly. SDD allows the VIN of an individual module to be synchronised with the remaining VIN coded modules in the vehicle, the VIN being stored an multiple modules. ;)

I've seen a few on ebay with failed timing belts, but crashed ones are much more common.:eek:
Click to expand...
So it must be triggering the self repair option. The setup is said to be stored in several modules. If a new one is fitted it should copy across and selfheal. Never tried it myself. Some modules may need 2 drive cycles.
 
Hippo said:
So it must be triggering the self repair option. The setup is said to be stored in several modules. If a new one is fitted it should copy across and selfheal. Never tried it myself. Some modules may need 2 drive cycles.
Click to expand...

SDD is the LR software, so all modules can be reprogrammed with it. You can't change multiple modules at one time, presumably this is to maintain security of the whole, simply because only one module is programmed to match the whole.

What I found is the LR dealer lied, or didn't know about a a second hand replacement ECU. The dealer told me that only a new ECU can be installed, and a second hand one can't. However I put a second hand replacement in, and SDD programmed it without any drama or errors. So why do LR say it can't be done, unless it's just to make more money.

Something else I noticed while messing about with the options. It appears that SDD could well allow a change in mapping. There is an option to update the ECU software, and in that option, there seemed to be a way to change the mapping from low power to high power, which is an interesting option.
 
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Nodge68 said:
SDD is the LR software, so all modules can be reprogrammed with it. You can't change multiple modules at one time, presumably this is to maintain security of the whole, simply because only one module is programmed to match the whole.

What I found is the LR dealer lied, or didn't know about a a second hand replacement ECU. The dealer told me that only a new ECU can be installed, and a second hand one can't. However I put a second hand replacement in, and SDD programmed it without any drama or errors. So why do LR say it can't be done, unless it's just to make more money.

Something else I noticed while messing about with the options. It appears that SDD could well allow a change in mapping. There is an option to update the ECU software, and in that option, there seemed to be a way to change the mapping from low power to high power, which is an interesting option.
Click to expand...
It could be a rule LR impose on dealers not to allow them to use second hand ecu's. It would hamper the warranty they have to provide. Theres lots of rules similar, like not selling cars with none LR wheels fitted. Peeps moan about profiteering but some of the drug dealer alloys don't look strong enough. They have to uphold a certain level of supply quality which is understandable and enforced by LR. They also only work in defined limits of manufacturer obtained type approval. If LR really didn't want it to happen then it's surprising its available in ssd. Ecu's would be vin locked when first programmed to block it. In theory you could clone all modules one by one, and create an identical car.

I looked at ssd some years ago but the official version is too eggspensive. The 'after market' ones all looked dodgy at the time.
 
How do the after market "ssd's" look now ?

Is there a good package available cheaply - like the BMW one ??
 
digby said:
How do the after market "ssd's" look now ?
Click to expand...
Mine is probably a genuine, but cracked/cloned/duplicated. You have to enter the user name given, and the PW too, and you can't let it update, as it stops working, so I've simply disabled WiFi on the laptop it's on.
It took me a while to get the drivers for the Mongoose cable to work, but that's more likely down to me being a bozo. :(
I paid £32 for the Mongoose Pro (probably a clone)https://www.cartool.co.uk/wholesale...xLN_JGgTcyaQZ_OXkDA22tTTsgMH4hwRoCdmMQAvD_BwE
(Now £34) but it came with SDD and the necessary drivers for the cable.

It works perfectly for what I've used it for (configuring a replacement engine ECU) and running loads of calibration routines too.
It works just fine IMO.
 
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