Jim_C · Feb 9, 2013

Hi Hippo,

Thks for the response.

Unfortunately I'm stymied at the moment as I don't have the Grey adaptor, and living out in the colonies (South Africa) it's going to take a little time to get one, and can only continue when I do.

I have just looked at one of your YouTube files and it looks interesting and will go through them all given time

I have only just got the Hawkeye, and used it for the first time today, and seem to be in for a long learning curve.

I have also downloaded the so-called operating manual from Bearmach, but it does not seem to tell you much. For example, when I do a self-test on the device I get a fail message, but no reason why, and the ops manual does not say anything about the problem. The unit is obviously communicating with the vehicle as I was able to check various vehicle functions in one of the menus

Do you know of another source of information relating to how to use the Hawkeye?

Thanks, Jim

Hippo · Feb 9, 2013

Jim_C said:
Hi Hippo,

Thks for the response.

Unfortunately I'm stymied at the moment as I don't have the Grey adaptor, and living out in the colonies (South Africa) it's going to take a little time to get one, and can only continue when I do.

I have just looked at one of your YouTube files and it looks interesting and will go through them all given time

I have only just got the Hawkeye, and used it for the first time today, and seem to be in for a long learning curve.

I have also downloaded the so-called operating manual from Bearmach, but it does not seem to tell you much. For example, when I do a self-test on the device I get a fail message, but no reason why, and the ops manual does not say anything about the problem. The unit is obviously communicating with the vehicle as I was able to check various vehicle functions in one of the menus

Do you know of another source of information relating to how to use the Hawkeye?

Thanks, Jim

I think yours is the MK20 so you won't need BA 5077. I use the following as a source of info. The hawkeye doesn't come with a manual and they won't supply one. Bit crap really. You only find out when you've spent about £300 buying a hawkeye.

https://www.blackbox-solutions.com/shop/help/

Worldlife · May 5, 2013

Hello from a newbie! Delighted to have found this discussion through Google. My vehicle is an October 2009 TD4 HSE Auto and it seems Landrover have not really taken on board the need to eliminate these long standing false system failure alerts.

DISGRACEFUL Do not mind a false ABS warning light but the associated turning off of the traction control system has more serious consequences. It could result in a driver trying to get home in adverse conditions experiencing an accident because vehicle unable to do what it is supposed to do. As with my previous Skoda Superb the ABS system was still working despite the false warning light. Mechanic advised that problem associated with using cheap and poor quality switches but was unable to replace with better quality ones. Suggested this was a problem that happened often with vehicles that were doing low mileages. I decided I would take the vehicle in for check in warning light did not clear. The warning lights have now self cancelled. APPALLING that these poorly designed systems are now in the MOT test and could incur the vehicle owner in expensive charges and MOT failure

Worldlife · May 5, 2013

george99 said:
As I had the same problem I hace found that a lot of places can read but not reset the codes. My problem was the front right sensor which was not picking up the signal from the wheel. If the lights are on constantly (the HDC will come on when you pull away) the ABS system has found what it believes to be a permanent or serious/dangerous fault and will not reset untill repairs have been undertaken. If you measure the resistance of each sensor (front ones have the conectors in the engine bay, left hand is behind the battery) you should get approx 1 - 1.5Ohms. If that's OK yiou can renove each sensor, give them a good clean and replace into the hub. The sensors are just a push fit and should come out with a little GENTLE persuasion. Do not hit or strike the sensors. Once they are clean reinsert them pushing them in as far as they can go. If they were dirty or had moved (possibly from hitting a kerb/going over a speedbump too fast/stalling/changing a wheel etc) the sensor will not pick up the magnetic signal from the phonic wheel.
Checking this in conjunction with the brake pedal and gearstick switch should solve the problem privided you haven't lost a sensor/ABS unit etc.

George.

I run on automatic light switch setting and the first time the ABS warning light set came up I was able to cancel the signal by setting the master light switch to manual. Was this just a coincidence or does it verify your findings?

Hippo · May 5, 2013

Worldlife said:
Hello from a newbie! Delighted to have found this discussion through Google. My vehicle is an October 2009 TD4 HSE Auto and it seems Landrover have not really taken on board the need to eliminate these long standing false system failure alerts.

DISGRACEFUL Do not mind a false ABS warning light but the associated turning off of the traction control system has more serious consequences. It could result in a driver trying to get home in adverse conditions experiencing an accident because vehicle unable to do what it is supposed to do. As with my previous Skoda Superb the ABS system was still working despite the false warning light. Mechanic advised that problem associated with using cheap and poor quality switches but was unable to replace with better quality ones. Suggested this was a problem that happened often with vehicles that were doing low mileages. I decided I would take the vehicle in for check in warning light did not clear. The warning lights have now self cancelled. APPALLING that these poorly designed systems are now in the MOT test and could incur the vehicle owner in expensive charges and MOT failure

Welcome to the forum.

In the UK your vehicle must be road legal to drive on the roads. If the ABS led comes on to warn there is a problem, then you have a choice to drive with a faulty abs system or not. It's the drivers choice. If they choose to risk driving into hazardous conditions then they need to take on the responsibility of their decision. It's far too easy to buy breakdown cover each year and call them up when needed during a breakdown to help by fixing your vehicle or taking you to your preferred destination - if cover permits which it should do if you choose the correct package. You can't blame the manufacturer for disabling the traction control when it finds a fault within the interlinked ABS system and it's peripherals, which the traction control uses. What the manufacturer has done is warn the driver the vehicle is mis-performing and faulty. Regardless of a fault or a mistake by a computer the driver has the choice to drive a faulty vehicle or not.

Worldlife · May 5, 2013

Hippo said:
Welcome to the forum.

In the UK your vehicle must be road legal to drive on the roads. If the ABS led comes on to warn there is a problem, then you have a choice to drive with a faulty abs system or not. It's the drivers choice. If they choose to risk driving into hazardous conditions then they need to take on the responsibility of their decision. It's far too easy to buy breakdown cover each year and call them up when needed during a breakdown to help by fixing your vehicle or taking you to your preferred destination - if cover permits which it should do if you choose the correct package. You can't blame the manufacturer for disabling the traction control when it finds a fault within the interlinked ABS system and it's peripherals, which the traction control uses. What the manufacturer has done is warn the driver the vehicle is mis-performing and faulty. Regardless of a fault or a mistake by a computer the driver has the choice to drive a faulty vehicle or not.

Thanks for your welcome and prompt reply. The problem here is that we are not dealing vehicle faults with faulty warning lights. If aircraft regularly had warning lights showing the landing wheels were not down when they were than the manufacturers would be required to find and rectify the cause of such warnings. Airline operators would not tolerate having to incur additional costs on inspections and maintenance because of an aircraft manufacturer providing faulty warning systems so why should the UK Motorist do so for our vehicles?

A faulty landing wheel light could put an aircraft in danger because the time to deal with could divert attention from more important matters or systems.

Similarly to put traction control out of use because of a faulty rear brake light switch could in severe weather or adverse terrain result in more of an accident risk to the driver than cancelling the terrain control.

When warning lights or the computers controlling them are unreliable the whole safety culture around them collapses.

td4van · May 5, 2013

Whilst you may think a brake light switch is only there for operating the rear brake lights the unfortunately it is not as simple as that on modern cars.

On your Freelander 2 it is used for various things including starting the car, to releasing the shift lever from park, informing the auto box whether you are braking or not and changing gear shift strategy accordingly and that's just some examples without even mentioning the use within the braking system.

If you have abs warning lights then they are coming on for a reason and the reason for then illuminating needs to be investigated.

Worldlife · May 5, 2013

td4van said:
Whilst you may think a brake light switch is only there for operating the rear brake lights the unfortunately it is not as simple as that on modern cars.

On your Freelander 2 it is used for various things including starting the car, to releasing the shift lever from park, informing the auto box whether you are braking or not and changing gear shift strategy accordingly and that's just some examples without even mentioning the use within the braking system.

If you have abs warning lights then they are coming on for a reason and the reason for then illuminating needs to be investigated.

Thanks for this logical explanation but the fact that the warning lights have now gone out on their own accord seems to substantiate the view of my mechanic that it was in all probability a false alert associated with infrequent use of the vehicle and poor quality components. If the warning lights come up again I will try to take the vehicle to a LandRover agent.

td4van · May 5, 2013

Ok no worries! In my opinion, your issue based on the little info I have from your posts, the issue may be down to a drop in battery voltage (maybe whilst cranking) causing a drop out on the CAN network in the car.

Good luck and hope you find out the cause soon.

Worldlife · May 5, 2013

td4van said:
Ok no worries! In my opinion, your issue based on the little info I have from your posts, the issue may be down to a drop in battery voltage (maybe whilst cranking) causing a drop out on the CAN network in the car.

Good luck and hope you find out the cause soon.

Brilliant remote diagnosis. Yes the vehicle does mainly frequent short journeys in the week. Try to give it a longish fast run at weekends to keep things healthy and boost the battery. Will see if the warning light problem is associated with heavy battery use between charging runs. We are still getting overnight frosts and the vehicle is not garaged. Thanks

Hippo · May 5, 2013

Worldlife said:
Thanks for your welcome and prompt reply. The problem here is that we are not dealing vehicle faults with faulty warning lights. If aircraft regularly had warning lights showing the landing wheels were not down when they were than the manufacturers would be required to find and rectify the cause of such warnings. Airline operators would not tolerate having to incur additional costs on inspections and maintenance because of an aircraft manufacturer providing faulty warning systems so why should the UK Motorist do so for our vehicles?

A faulty landing wheel light could put an aircraft in danger because the time to deal with could divert attention from more important matters or systems.

Similarly to put traction control out of use because of a faulty rear brake light switch could in severe weather or adverse terrain result in more of an accident risk to the driver than cancelling the terrain control.

When warning lights or the computers controlling them are unreliable the whole safety culture around them collapses.

Aircraft is totally different. They get service checks before flight. When they go wrong they can fall out of the sky. Hence when they get grounded due to another of the same design failing. Car owners regularly fail to check tyre pressure, water level, oil level etc.

Cars aren't as complex as aircraft. Electronics is very reliable these days. There are some cars that go wrong (mine has a mind of it's own at the moment) but the majority are ok most of the time. To assume poor parts across the model or brand just because you have a failure is wrong. You need regular failures for this to be true. The car industry is looking for reliability v cost. The MOT station is looking for minimum levels of safety. It should be noted that's the minimum not the bench mark for your cars roadworthiness for another year. If something fails it should be fixed to keep it up to standard to be on the road. Your car is warning you something is wrong. Sounds like the fault is intermittent. Regardless of what the fault is you have the choice to flog it and get something else or get it fixed. The car industry and government int trying to rip you off. You have the choice to buy a code reader and investigate the fault yourself. If your car is dangerous and not roadworthy then it shouldn't be on the road. Blaming the establishment for lack of TC int no excuse. Good luck with the fix.

goonarmy · May 5, 2013

A lack of traction control is not a danger. Otherwise itd be compulsary on all vehicles.

Hippo · May 5, 2013

If TC is fitted then they want it to be available and working if needed. I agree it's not needed all the time.

jedi · May 13, 2013

To revive an old post......I have the same problem 3 Amigos

New ABS sensors all round, cleaned reluctor rings and checked for damage

New brake light switch fitted, if fact all the common things done

I am starting to suspect the G sensor, I have already swapped it out for a VW one and its still the same.

The 3 Amigos seem to come on when I brake and the car jerks to a halt (Automatic).

With the diagnostics for Landrover can the sensor be re-calibrated???

Because with the VW/audi diagnostics it can be recalibrated to zero, when fitting a new one??? Does the landy one need the same? They look identical to me bar the different part numbers, both made by ate.

The Audi TT Forum :: View topic - "How to" Reset Long/Lat Sensors (G200/G251 or G419?)

Hippo · May 13, 2013

jedi said:
...The 3 Amigos seem to come on when I brake and the car jerks to a halt (Automatic)...

Hi

My auto also jerks when I slow down through approx. 5 to 8mph as if it's doing it when changing down to second gear. All other down and up changes are smooth as they should be. An oil change improved it so it now does it less often. I don't have any other faults but was already wondering if a signal referencing slowing down was intermittently triggering my jerk. I don't have any other faults. At what speed does yours do the jerk when slowing down?

jedi · May 14, 2013

I think the jerk in mine is normal, its not a violent jerk, I think that because its an automatic there is always constant drive to the wheels, when I brake to a stop I still feel a bit or drive. Its at nearly stopped speed 1-2 mph. There is no jerk if I flip it into netral before fully stopping.

Its this jerk that used to set the 3 little buggers, but now its very intermittant.???

Ive done all the oil changes etc a while ago, I remember you were also part of the Long Jacto auto box fluid change thread.:5bhurray:

I flushed mine 4 times, but it wasnt giving any problems in the 1st place......

Im going to check the front ABS sensors again as these where changed around a year or 2 ago, as they were only £20 each they may well be failing?

Really could do with a Diag scan, But at £80 a scan from my independant, its cheaper to buy and try the sensors again......

Hippo · May 14, 2013

jedi said:
I think the jerk in mine is normal, its not a violent jerk, I think that because its an automatic there is always constant drive to the wheels, when I brake to a stop I still feel a bit or drive. Its at nearly stopped speed 1-2 mph. There is no jerk if I flip it into netral before fully stopping.

Its this jerk that used to set the 3 little buggers, but now its very intermittant.???

Ive done all the oil changes etc a while ago, I remember you were also part of the Long Jacto auto box fluid change thread.:5bhurray:

I flushed mine 4 times, but it wasnt giving any problems in the 1st place......

Im going to check the front ABS sensors again as these where changed around a year or 2 ago, as they were only £20 each they may well be failing?

Really could do with a Diag scan, But at £80 a scan from my independant, its cheaper to buy and try the sensors again......

You can check abs sensors yourself with a meter. Lift the wheels off the ground, break open the yellow abs connector and use a meter to first measure the resistance, then the frequency or ac volts depending on what functions your meter has, as you spin the wheel. You tube has video's of others doing this.

jedi · May 17, 2013

Well managed to tap the front ABS sensor out, they did seem to have a lot of crap on them, mainly metal filings rust etc, so wiped these off and all seems ok Touch wood for now.....As long as they hold out through the MOT next week I will be a happy Hippo owner......

lozzzz · Jan 16, 2014

I have spent a fortune on the 3 amegos diagnostic checks .i have replaced the abs pump 2 front wheel seniors .before I replaced the abs pump I was getting kick back at very low speeds on the brake pedal.all that has gone now since replacing the pump but the lights come on intermitantly .the brakes work perfectly.so When landrover dealers said it would cost more to fix than what I paid for the td4.for the sake of 3 lights .i decided to modify things a bit .all the mot guy wants to see is a abs light come on for 3 seconds and go out.well I thought how hard can that be.so I bought a electronics starter kit for £15 and with a little help from YouTube I created it.which is a lot cheaper than landrover dealers. But I do stress this is the last resort.you must try to resolve the problem first because abs does what it says .anyhow if you want to know how it's done you can build this with a 555 timer go on YouTube 2nd half of video beginner 555 ic tutorial.once you have made the breadboard curcuit,you will need a dc/dc 12v to 9v step down for it to work but you don't need the switch.you need to drill a hole where the abs light is and connect to a live wire that will switch off on key,there is a wire loom at the back of the clocks.test any of the pins on the plug connector to find which wire will do this.splice the wire and solder yours to the 12v reducer and put a in line 3amp fuse then the other wire needs to be earthed. Hope the helps anyone who has had the same problem.dont forget to tell future owners of the modifications what has been done.

Nodge68 · Jan 16, 2014

lozzzz said:
I have spent a fortune on the 3 amegos diagnostic checks .i have replaced the abs pump 2 front wheel seniors .before I replaced the abs pump I was getting kick back at very low speeds on the brake pedal.all that has gone now since replacing the pump but the lights come on intermitantly .the brakes work perfectly.so When landrover dealers said it would cost more to fix than what I paid for the td4.for the sake of 3 lights .i decided to modify things a bit .all the mot guy wants to see is a abs light come on for 3 seconds and go out.well I thought how hard can that be.so I bought a electronics starter kit for £15 and with a little help from YouTube I created it.which is a lot cheaper than landrover dealers. But I do stress this is the last resort.you must try to resolve the problem first because abs does what it says .anyhow if you want to know how it's done you can build this with a 555 timer go on YouTube 2nd half of video beginner 555 ic tutorial.once you have made the breadboard curcuit,you will need a dc/dc 12v to 9v step down for it to work but you don't need the switch.you need to drill a hole where the abs light is and connect to a live wire that will switch off on key,there is a wire loom at the back of the clocks.test any of the pins on the plug connector to find which wire will do this.splice the wire and solder yours to the 12v reducer and put a in line 3amp fuse then the other wire needs to be earthed. Hope the helps anyone who has had the same problem.dont forget to tell future owners of the modifications what has been done.

Technically that is bodge designed to fool the MOT tester that the ABS is working.

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