Electrics never my strong suit but where does the fl2 take its engine temp reading from? Coolant or air temp? Iirc most cars if you unplug the temp sensor put the cooling fan on as a safety device worth trying to trick it to see how it runs when technically stone cold but computer sees a hot reading
 
LUKBENPHI said:
Electrics never my strong suit but where does the fl2 take its engine temp reading from? Coolant or air temp? Iirc most cars if you unplug the temp sensor put the cooling fan on as a safety device worth trying to trick it to see how it runs when technically stone cold but computer sees a hot reading
Click to expand...
The EDC16 ECU takes coolant temperature from the thermostat housing.
Ambient air temperature from the LH door mirror sensor.
Boosted air temperature from the intake manifold.
And the MAF will provide intake air temperature.

If the engine temperature sensor doesn't return a suitable reading, then the cooling fans come on and the high temperature warning lamp on the dash is illuminated. The engine will also reduce power output, to keep temperature under control. Putting the reduced engine power message on the dash at the same time. It'll also disable the TR system.

I don't think the EDC does anything with then fueling, other than limit maximum torque.
 
The more I think about this, the more I'm inclined to suspect the Bosch EDC16 ECU.

I'm wondering if it has a dry solder joint, which would explain it starting to work when it's warmed up. Unfortunately they're not easy to take apart, at least not without causing visible evidence of tampering, which could make a subsequent professional repair difficult.
 
Nodge68 said:
The more I think about this, the more I'm inclined to suspect the Bosch EDC16 ECU.

I'm wondering if it has a dry solder joint, which would explain it starting to work when it's warmed up. Unfortunately they're not easy to take apart, at least not without causing visible evidence of tampering, which could make a subsequent professional repair difficult.
Click to expand...
Hi Nodge, sorry to see you still have a running problem with the F2. Having spent 20yrs as a Honda trained m/c mechanic I fully agree with your points on lack of 'mechanics' about, just fitters these days (I try to repair everything if possible even if it takes me longer).
Anyway back to your running problems I can't see it being compression, or lack of, as in my experience compression doesn't really restore itself once warm e.g you can have valve clearances(on vehicles with adjustable shims/lock nut & screw) which are on the tight side, normally start ok when cold but once warm/hot will fail to idle properly & are harder to start. The fact that no2 cyl. was damaged & now runs ok & it's no3 that's causing you issues,( you've proved its not the injector itself) I agree with you it must be something electrical so I would continue along that path. All I can say is best of luck from someone who's only real experience is with petrol engines mostly without fuel injection ! So I will bow to your experience with all things with four wheels.;)
 
Andy Warren said:
Hi Nodge, sorry to see you still have a running problem with the F2. Having spent 20yrs as a Honda trained m/c mechanic I fully agree with your points on lack of 'mechanics' about, just fitters these days (I try to repair everything if possible even if it takes me longer).
Anyway back to your running problems I can't see it being compression, or lack of, as in my experience compression doesn't really restore itself once warm e.g you can have valve clearances(on vehicles with adjustable shims/lock nut & screw) which are on the tight side, normally start ok when cold but once warm/hot will fail to idle properly & are harder to start. The fact that no2 cyl. was damaged & now runs ok & it's no3 that's causing you issues,( you've proved its not the injector itself) I agree with you it must be something electrical so I would continue along that path. All I can say is best of luck from someone who's only real experience is with petrol engines mostly without fuel injection ! So I will bow to your experience with all things with four wheels.;)
Click to expand...

Thanks for the confidence. Although my common rail diesel experience is limited.
I'll get there, but it's bugging me at the moment.
I'm thinking it's the EDC, maybe a dry solder joint, or even an output driver MosFet.
Until I can get the scope on it, I can't move forward.
 
Might be totally off track, but a guy at work had issues with poor runnings/starting on a diesel mondeo, and in the end it was down to his dmf breaking up, I guess it wobbled so much the pulse ring to sensor gap went out of range?
 
andyfreelandy said:
The attachment shows a 6V pulse!!
Click to expand...

Something isn't correct there, as piezoelectric elements stacked require high voltage, as they're very high resistance.
The manual gives the injector specifications.
20201005_224035.jpg

The FL2 injector requires 110 to 150V, the FL1 TD4 injectors require less at 90 Volts. ;)
 
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I know it does Nodge but check their address at the bottom of the page, also if you check the postage options it says it could come from any of their warehouses. Also the postage is "Economy Delivery (Other Courier 3 days)" which all the Chinese sellers use when it isn't being sent by Royal Mail.
It might be quick or it might not but if you really want to be sure it might be best to buy from another supplier.
 
Alibro said:
I know it does Nodge but check their address at the bottom of the page, also if you check the postage options it says it could come from any of their warehouses. Also the postage is "Economy Delivery (Other Courier 3 days)" which all the Chinese sellers use when it isn't being sent by Royal Mail.
It might be quick or it might not but if you really want to be sure it might be best to buy from another supplier.
Click to expand...

Thanks Ali. I use the Ebay app, which misses some of the seller's information.

I'm going to hold fire for the moment. It's been suggested on another forum, that I artificially warm up the ECU, prior to starting the engine. The theory being that if the ECU has a dry solder joint which closes when warm, then the artificial heating should fix the issue with the engine cold. I have the equipment to do that, so I'll use what I have first.

If heating the ECU works, then I know I've got to delve deeper, and maybe crack out the magnifying glass.
 
The Ebay App is very poor. It is really hard to see any info at all and I never use it for that reason.
Not if I have a choice anyway.
 
It seems oscilloscope use is becoming more and more necessary.
Post your findings and usage if you could.

I think a lot if chinky sellers have stock in the UK.
 
J_D said:
It seems oscilloscope use is becoming more and more necessary.
Post your findings and usage if you could.

I think a lot if chinky sellers have stock in the UK.
Click to expand...

It' so true that oscilloscope is necessary for diagnostics now, especially true for diesels, where the EDC isn't as good as the petrol ECU as far as sensor feedback and diagnostics are concerned.
For instance a typical petrol ECU is quite capable of indicating a misfire on a particular cylinder, even though the injector and coil are both working correctly. It does this using the feedback from the crank position sensor, by monitoring the actual acceleration of each firing stroke.

Lots of diesel EDCs can't do this, so diagnostics are very limited indeed. For instance the Bosch EDC 16 of my FL2 doesn't know that there's an issue with the cylinder, and so shows no faults, as the injector is in circuit. This particular EDC doesn't even give the option to display injector offsets, which really doesn't help. If an injector goes out of spec, requiring larger offsets than is possible to do, then the EDC will simply provide a code, which basically says maximum injector offset reached.

The annoying thing about these common rail piezoelectric injectors, is the voltage and current is high, making identification of faults difficult.
 
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