S

Sacha McVay

Member
Hi all,
Ive been reading all of your helpful advice to others with similar issues to me over the past few days and due to my failure in fixing my D2 I thought that it is now time to create an account and explain my problem.
I have had Landrovers for years now but never a D2, always a trusty defender with hardly any electrics to go wrong...
I bought a D2 as defender is currently off the road being rebuilt (chassis buggered and whilst I was at it I thought I might just redo the whole thing... as you do...). The D2 is in good condition for its age (1999 20 years old), however, when I come to start it, sometimes it turns over and starts, and sometimes not... I tracked down somebody with a decent computer to plug into it and disable the immobiliser yesterday and after that it was absolutely fine, started first time for the rest of the day. Came to start it this morning and it would turn over but not fire up (similar to immobiliser issue but obviously not that s it has been disabled). Called the RAC out as I have the membership and thought I might just let them try with all their fancy technology... didn't work... Basically what is happening now is the same temperamental issue - sometimes it fires up and sometimes it doesn't, but I've now worked out that when it doesn't fire up the engine management light does not appear when ignition turned to position II, and it will fire up if engine management light shows when ignition turned to position II... I'm thinking dodgy ECU but have checked all wiring and is all pretty decent with no oil leaked all over it...
So, to sum up:
- Temperamental starter
- Engine light sometimes not showing when ignition at position II
- Clean fuse box (have tested every single fuse and all working fine along with relays)
- Clean wiring and plugs to ECU
- Diagnostic system cannot get in to check the ECU elements (not sure why)
- When engine management light not showing the fuel pump doesn't make a sound and when engine management light does show the fuel pump kicks in and car starts up....

It is driving me crazy... what do I do?? Please tell me if there is something extremely obvious I am forgetting about or if anyone else is having/has had the same issue...
 
Hi Sacha,

I've had my D2 only 9 months and it has done something similar twice, once in a neighbour's drive when we wanted to go home and 4k miles later in our drive before going shopping. Each time the engine fired on the first compression stroke after turning to start, then immediately stopped. The pump was running (unlike yours) but then there was absolutely no attempt to fire on any cylinder. On the second time, I noticed that the glowplug light light didn't come on when turning to position 2 (I always wait for the glowplug light to go out, hot or cold before trying to start). I didn't notice the engine management light.

Each time the problem happened it started after taking out the keys, getting out the car, locking it with the fob, waiting until the immobiliser light stopped flashing, unlock with the fob, get back in and start and it started instantly.

There were no faults recorded as read by the Nanocom each time, but I didn't have a chance to connect the Nanocom while the fault was present.

I can only assume this is some immobiliser issue, but as mine has only occurred twice, it's difficult to track down.

Sorry I can't help more with yours directly, but my guess is immobiliser related.

Cheers.
 
PopPops said:
Hi Sacha,

I've had my D2 only 9 months and it has done something similar twice, once in a neighbour's drive when we wanted to go home and 4k miles later in our drive before going shopping. Each time the engine fired on the first compression stroke after turning to start, then immediately stopped. The pump was running (unlike yours) but then there was absolutely no attempt to fire on any cylinder. On the second time, I noticed that the glowplug light light didn't come on when turning to position 2 (I always wait for the glowplug light to go out, hot or cold before trying to start). I didn't notice the engine management light.

Each time the problem happened it started after taking out the keys, getting out the car, locking it with the fob, waiting until the immobiliser light stopped flashing, unlock with the fob, get back in and start and it started instantly.

There were no faults recorded as read by the Nanocom each time, but I didn't have a chance to connect the Nanocom while the fault was present.

I can only assume this is some immobiliser issue, but as mine has only occurred twice, it's difficult to track down.

Sorry I can't help more with yours directly, but my guess is immobiliser related.

Cheers.
Click to expand...
Hi,
Thank you for your reply. I am going to have a further look into the whole immobiliser issue again tomorrow as it could be related to the BCU which I understand can be found somewhere behind the bulkhead in the dash on the passenger side as I have no sunroofs (so can't be behind the front sunroof as I understand others are)... Perhaps I could send the BCU and the ECU off somewhere to be examined... this process looks quite expensive though. I suppose its better than having a non-running truck....
 
.... When engine management light not showing the fuel pump doesn't make a sound and when engine management light does show the fuel pump kicks in and car starts up....
Click to expand...
Hi. The quoted part is the gist of it . Replace the main relay R9 with a new one to be ruled out cos it seems that it has intermittent activity... if that doesnt help check the connection at the inertia switch, when the symptom occurs unplug the inertia switch(attached), bridge the pins in the plug with a wire and try then, if still no joy remove relay R9 and bridge the perpendicular cavities in the fusebox and try so. You should make sure that there are good contacts in the fusebox's connectors eventually. I suspect that the problem is on the main relay's path cos if it doesnt close the MIL is missing and the fuel pump disabled so it will crank and not start exactly like in your case.... if these are ruled out and the symptom persists only then the ECM is suspect unless it's a wiring issue on the main relay's circuit, i doubt that the BCU has much to do with that.... immobiliser would not let it crank that's how it works... according to the results of these tricks i'll tell you more
 

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When I changed my key fob over, I suddenly noticed that I could unlock the car, get in, maybe a few minutes later and the car would not crank. Then I noticed that if I pushed the "unlock" button on the fob, it would start. Now I am used to it it isn't a problem.
I did notice that when it wouldn't start the red alarmed light in the centre of the bottom of the dash was illuminated, and went off once I pressed the plip. don't know if this is your problem, but maybe it is.
Maybe someone else will benefit from my barmy problem and barmy solution!
 
Stanleysteamer said:
When I changed my key fob over, I suddenly noticed that I could unlock the car, get in, maybe a few minutes later and the car would not crank. Then I noticed that if I pushed the "unlock" button on the fob, it would start...
Click to expand...
That's different and a bit off topic cos the OP's is cranking with missing MIL on and no pump activity... your problem is simple, the fob you've got is a Rover 75 fob which is identical and often sold as D2 fob but doesnt have the hardware to work with the pasive remobilisation exciter coil so you have to remobilise it with the unlock command after the passive immo kicks in
 
Last edited:
sierrafery said:
Hi. The quoted part is the gist of it . Replace the main relay R9 with a new one to be ruled out cos it seems that it has intermittent activity... if that doesnt help check the connection at the inertia switch, when the symptom occurs unplug the inertia switch(attached), bridge the pins in the plug with a wire and try then, if still no joy remove relay R9 and bridge the perpendicular cavities in the fusebox and try so. You should make sure that there are good contacts in the fusebox's connectors eventually. I suspect that the problem is on the main relay's path cos if it doesnt close the MIL is missing and the fuel pump disabled so it will crank and not start exactly like in your case.... if these are ruled out and the symptom persists only then the ECM is suspect unless it's a wiring issue on the main relay's circuit, i doubt that the BCU has much to do with that.... immobiliser would not let it crank that's how it works... according to the results of these tricks i'll tell you more
Click to expand...
Hi, thanks for your reply. That is really helpful. I will get onto testing a few of these bits and bobs out today and let you know what is happening this evening... I did try resetting the inertia switch but it didn't really do anything... I guess if I bridge a wire around it it will tell me if there is a problem with the switch itself... I did switch around a few relays which didn't do anything so I put them all back to the places they came from, I doubt any spares shops will be open today, but I could take a main relay out of the defender I have here (not sure if that will work??). If all of that fails would you say to replace the inertia switch before I take apart the dash to find the main relay wiring??? Thanks again for your help, really appreciated.
 
the main relay's wiring is not under the dash, it's all in the engine bay...let's hope it's just a bad contact somewhere, the inertia switch's wiring used to get hurt.... if you dont have RAVE download one for the connector views and if non of the tricks i told you works i'll tell you more
 
sierrafery said:
the main relay's wiring is not under the dash, it's all in the engine bay...let's hope it's just a bad contact somewhere, the inertia switch's wiring used to get hurt.... if you dont have RAVE download one for the connector views and if non of the tricks i told you works i'll tell you more
Click to expand...
So I fiddled around this morning... tested the inertia switch all was okay. I then went underneath the steering wheel to the fusebox under there and found the engine management relay... I took it out and put it back in and engine started first time no problems...turned it off and on a few times and all was okay... lets hope the issue doesn't go any further than that... I have ordered a new relay fuse which is genuine landcover as I thought I might swell just buy the best of quality to give it no excuses... If I have any more problems with it I will jump straight back on here and tell all.
Thanks again for your help. Fingers crossed it doesn't break down in the fuel station!!!
 
sierrafery said:
That's different and a bit off topic cos the OP's is cranking with missing MIL on and no pump activity... your problem is simple, the fob you've got is a Rover 75 fob which is identical and often sold as D2 fob but doesnt have the hardware to work with the pasive remobilisation exciter coil so you have to remobilise it with the unlock command after the passive immo kicks in
Click to expand...
Well that is interesting. The fob I bought was an empty fob, it just had the plastic flexible bits intact, so I took the circuit board and battery and put them in the new keyfob, to keep them dry and left the transducer in the old keyfob, with the key to turn the ignition and everything works. Maybe the fob with the circuit board in is just a bit too far away to keep the electrical system ready to enable me to start the car and, as you say, after a little time, the passive immobilisation kicks in, hence the need to repush the "door open" dis-alarm button on the fob. I just could not be bothered to get a new key cut and transfer everything into the new fob.
 
Sacha McVay said:
I then went underneath the steering wheel to the fusebox under there and found the engine management relay.
Click to expand...
Is your's a V8 then? ... cos there is no engine management relay in the interior fusebox for Td5... if it's V8 that's the ignition coil relay not for engine management but as you fiddled there and the symptom went away the problem might be with the fusebox which is quite common cos they used to suffer from corrosion, fortunately is cheap and no need for programming if you swap it
Stanleysteamer said:
The fob I bought was an empty fob, it just had the plastic flexible bits intact, so I took the circuit board and battery and put them in the new keyfob,
Click to expand...
An empty shell is not a fob in my mind so whe you said you bought a new fob i thought about the whole thing ... if that fob is a D2 one and you have the problem you described it means the passive coil is gone.
 
sierrafery said:
Is your's a V8 then? ... cos there is no engine management relay in the interior fusebox for Td5... if it's V8 that's the ignition coil relay not for engine management but as you fiddled there and the symptom went away the problem might be with the fusebox which is quite common cos they used to suffer from corrosion, fortunately is cheap and no need for programming if you swap it

An empty shell is not a fob in my mind so whe you said you bought a new fob i thought about the whole thing ... if that fob is a D2 one and you have the problem you described it means the passive coil is gone.
Click to expand...
It is doing it again... its a 2.5l TD5... on the back of the cover on the interior fusebox it has the sign for engine management... I just popped out for 20mins and it wouldn't start again the other side... took the relay out and back in again on the interior fusebox and it went. Have now got home and thought I would leave it for 10 mins and go back and see if it would start, nothing! Fiddled around for 15mins and still nothing - again, fuel pump not kicking in and engine management light not appearing on dash when turned to position II... Unfortunately, my new relay will not be here until Tuesday...
 
You can still do what i told you by using a piece of wire... maybe what you did at the interior fusebox was just coincidental, it has not much to do with your symptom
 
sierrafery said:
You can still do what i told you by using a piece of wire... maybe what you did at the interior fusebox was just coincidental, it has not much to do with your symptom
Click to expand...
I will try with a bit of wire in the fusebox tomorrow as haven't got a piece long enough here. I think I've found another problem... fuel injector harness plug is covered in oil (the one going from red ecu plug to the injector harness)... must be causing problems as it really is drowning in oil. I am going to order a new injector harness to replace it anyway as that can't be good for the old girl. Tried to take off the cover to the engine to get to the injector harness and first two bolts I loosened snapped off... I have now deemed the car un-driveable until I replace the bolts on cover so it is secured along with the injector harness...
 
Sacha McVay said:
Hi all,
Ive been reading all of your helpful advice to others with similar issues to me over the past few days and due to my failure in fixing my D2 I thought that it is now time to create an account and explain my problem.
I have had Landrovers for years now but never a D2, always a trusty defender with hardly any electrics to go wrong...
I bought a D2 as defender is currently off the road being rebuilt (chassis buggered and whilst I was at it I thought I might just redo the whole thing... as you do...). The D2 is in good condition for its age (1999 20 years old), however, when I come to start it, sometimes it turns over and starts, and sometimes not... I tracked down somebody with a decent computer to plug into it and disable the immobiliser yesterday and after that it was absolutely fine, started first time for the rest of the day. Came to start it this morning and it would turn over but not fire up (similar to immobiliser issue but obviously not that s it has been disabled). Called the RAC out as I have the membership and thought I might just let them try with all their fancy technology... didn't work... Basically what is happening now is the same temperamental issue - sometimes it fires up and sometimes it doesn't, but I've now worked out that when it doesn't fire up the engine management light does not appear when ignition turned to position II, and it will fire up if engine management light shows when ignition turned to position II... I'm thinking dodgy ECU but have checked all wiring and is all pretty decent with no oil leaked all over it...
So, to sum up:
- Temperamental starter
- Engine light sometimes not showing when ignition at position II
- Clean fuse box (have tested every single fuse and all working fine along with relays)
- Clean wiring and plugs to ECU
- Diagnostic system cannot get in to check the ECU elements (not sure why)
- When engine management light not showing the fuel pump doesn't make a sound and when engine management light does show the fuel pump kicks in and car starts up....

It is driving me crazy... what do I do?? Please tell me if there is something extremely obvious I am forgetting about or if anyone else is having/has had the same issue...
Click to expand...
Hi mate I had same fault it was a broken white wire on the n/s inner flitch near bulk head
 
The injector loom has nothing to do with missing MIL and non running pump ... i clearely pointed what can cause that in my first reply and you keep digging in other places... your choice, i rest my case
 
Last edited:
sierrafery said:
The injector loom has nothing to do with missing MIL and non running pump ... i clearely pointed what can cause that in my first reply and you keep digging in other places... your choice, i rest my case
Click to expand...
Sorry, you're right... I'm going off topic... easily done with a landrover! So, I have bridged the perpendicular cavities in the fusebox and it is still not starting... where is my next port of call?
 
Sacha McVay said:
Sorry, you're right... I'm going off topic... easily done with a landrover! So, I have bridged the perpendicular cavities in the fusebox and it is still not starting... where is my next port of call?
Click to expand...
Let me adjust that statement slightly... EXTREMELY INTERMITTENT not starting... have done absolutely nothing differently and suddenly everything has just kicked in and car started no problem quite a few times... turned it off and took key out of ignition closed all doors and locked and unlocked and tried again and started again.... This is driving me crazy...
 
Sacha McVay said:
Tried to take off the cover to the engine to get to the injector harness and first two bolts I loosened snapped off... I have now deemed the car un-driveable until I replace the bolts on cover so it is secured along with the injector harness...
Click to expand...
Don't worry about the cover, it does very little and you can drive the car safely without it. Take the third nut off, take the cover off and store it. Don't let it stop you using the car!
 
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