Ants2
Member
Ok cool, did you cut into the floor where the seats are bolted down for the air intake and exhaust and where did you place the fuel tank ? I was concerned about tapping into fuel line...
Ants2
Member
Just hot air...
I would go for a standpipe everytime, keep the heater totally seperate from all other systems on the car so in the event of failure the car will still work as expected and get you home.
You can get standpipes that you bore a hole in the top of the tank, drop the pipe in, tighten the nut which causes the seal to swell and er seal the pipe into place.
bankz5152
Well-Known Member
I'm haveing similar thoughts re fitting a deisel heater. Having a seperate tank means you can run it on red deisel at near half the price. However locating the tank is important. You don't need it to be above the heater, as it has it's own pump. But idealy you want it to be filled from outside the car, because deisel spilt inside will stink for weeks.
My car is a 90 making locating the heater a bit harder so as not to be in the way. I'm erring toward fitting a false floor, ie a board accross the rear wheel arches making a big flat floor, with the heater against the bulkhead below it.
My car is a 90 making locating the heater a bit harder so as not to be in the way. I'm erring toward fitting a false floor, ie a board accross the rear wheel arches making a big flat floor, with the heater against the bulkhead below it.
Colthebrummie
Well-Known Member
Routing the exhaust away from the car seems to me to be the biggest problem considering the heater may be in use whilst stationary, landys are hardly airtight.
Col
Col
Air in-take and exhaust are both the biggest issue, as they go vertically down. A big concern if offroading, espacialy wading/fording.
I fitted a Webasto (water type) in my series as its a camper. There are a few things to consider:
You should not be routing a fuel line inside the vehicle and the same would apply to any extra tank.
You should have the combustion unit outside the vehicle if you are sleeping in it in case it catches fire. They are usually in a metal box under the floor on trucks and campers and in a vented box on narrow boats. My water one is under the bonnet but we still have a smoke alarm.
The exhaust must be mounted where it cannot get back in. This is not as easy as it sounds (if it sounded easy!). Its fine if its windy, but a calm cold day is a problem as it can casue a cloud around the vehicle. Mine exhausts just behind the N/S front wheel and we take care to check the wind direction when parking up for the night, but to be sure we also have a battery CO alarm.
What does for the air ones is getting water in and seizing the fan bearings, this is common because they are often undeneath the vehicle and not well protected. A benefit of the water type is you can mount it high under the bonnet with only hot water coming into the passenger / sleeping compartment.
I can't say about the cheap Chinese ones (I too have read favourable reviews) but Webasto have a detailed set of installation instructions covering fire, fuel and CO that require a certified installer - essentially they treat it like a min-diesel combi-boiler which is what the water type is. I bought second hand (£75 vs £900!) and downloaded the instructions.
My question would be "why do you want one?" If its to pre-heat then get a water one as the engine will be warmed up too. If its for camping / sleeping then don't mount it inside. They shut off on low voltage but from experience I would say they work best with a leisure battery of at least 100ah. We have 100 ah and its a bit marginal. I find the Webasto draws rather more current than the spec. I think the spec is one start then run, but in reality they cut in and out so you get a lot of starts and the ignition is a glow plug that draws 7A at least. The water one is worse because its running a fan and a water pump then also an auxilliary heater fan in the cab.
We wouldn't be without ours to the exstent that I always have a servicable spare ready to swap in if we are going camping, we have had a good night's sleep with an outside temp of -2c and been able to wash and dress without freezing. (I didn't say "in comfort" because there's no such thing in a Series!). The other thing is they are noisy, a bit like a mini-jet engine which is another good reason to put them outside if you plan to sleep.
You should not be routing a fuel line inside the vehicle and the same would apply to any extra tank.
You should have the combustion unit outside the vehicle if you are sleeping in it in case it catches fire. They are usually in a metal box under the floor on trucks and campers and in a vented box on narrow boats. My water one is under the bonnet but we still have a smoke alarm.
The exhaust must be mounted where it cannot get back in. This is not as easy as it sounds (if it sounded easy!). Its fine if its windy, but a calm cold day is a problem as it can casue a cloud around the vehicle. Mine exhausts just behind the N/S front wheel and we take care to check the wind direction when parking up for the night, but to be sure we also have a battery CO alarm.
What does for the air ones is getting water in and seizing the fan bearings, this is common because they are often undeneath the vehicle and not well protected. A benefit of the water type is you can mount it high under the bonnet with only hot water coming into the passenger / sleeping compartment.
I can't say about the cheap Chinese ones (I too have read favourable reviews) but Webasto have a detailed set of installation instructions covering fire, fuel and CO that require a certified installer - essentially they treat it like a min-diesel combi-boiler which is what the water type is. I bought second hand (£75 vs £900!) and downloaded the instructions.
My question would be "why do you want one?" If its to pre-heat then get a water one as the engine will be warmed up too. If its for camping / sleeping then don't mount it inside. They shut off on low voltage but from experience I would say they work best with a leisure battery of at least 100ah. We have 100 ah and its a bit marginal. I find the Webasto draws rather more current than the spec. I think the spec is one start then run, but in reality they cut in and out so you get a lot of starts and the ignition is a glow plug that draws 7A at least. The water one is worse because its running a fan and a water pump then also an auxilliary heater fan in the cab.
We wouldn't be without ours to the exstent that I always have a servicable spare ready to swap in if we are going camping, we have had a good night's sleep with an outside temp of -2c and been able to wash and dress without freezing. (I didn't say "in comfort" because there's no such thing in a Series!). The other thing is they are noisy, a bit like a mini-jet engine which is another good reason to put them outside if you plan to sleep.
They dont use a lot of derv, Iirc 1/2 litre per hour at full chat ramping down as the cabin temp rises.
General rule I have found on air and hot water versions is 30 minutes is more than enough and is also the makers minimum run time to stop carboning up of the combustion chamber.
So long as the exhaust is pointing towards the outside of the car gases shouldnt be an issue.
Ants2
Member
A genuine thank you for all the responses. It’s given me a lot to consider. Realistically it’s going to take more effort to do this well than I initially thought.
My primary reason for a diesel heater is that I work outdoors through the winter and I use my Landy 110 as refuge. I’m usually soaking wet and frozen. I don’t want to run the engine all day so I thought a diesel heater could be a solution.
So I’m thinking heater located under second row of seats with exhaust and intakes running opposite directions under vehicle. Supplied by a separate fuel tank also located under the vehicle. Any help on suitable fuel tanks that can be refilled externally??
My primary reason for a diesel heater is that I work outdoors through the winter and I use my Landy 110 as refuge. I’m usually soaking wet and frozen. I don’t want to run the engine all day so I thought a diesel heater could be a solution.
So I’m thinking heater located under second row of seats with exhaust and intakes running opposite directions under vehicle. Supplied by a separate fuel tank also located under the vehicle. Any help on suitable fuel tanks that can be refilled externally??
The Webasto Airtop installation manual has section (P41 on) which has the relevent legal requirments. The way I read it inside the cab is not permiited unless in a vented box to out side, and its not permitted to take combustion air from inside. Now this is Webasto not the Chinese kit and these rules are EU rules that may not apply in a few months time, but my understanding of the Withdrawl Act is that it writes EU regs into UK law with the plan to progressively take them out later so it could still be an issue. Here's the link, its the first few pages:
https://www.butlertechnik.com/downloads/Webasto_Airtop_2000ST_Installation_Instruction.pdf
When I did my own installtion I made the decision to comply with the installation manual as I felt this was both safer and eaiser to defend (explain) if anything went wrong.
https://www.butlertechnik.com/downloads/Webasto_Airtop_2000ST_Installation_Instruction.pdf
When I did my own installtion I made the decision to comply with the installation manual as I felt this was both safer and eaiser to defend (explain) if anything went wrong.
Colthebrummie
Well-Known Member
Don't forget, starting the heater takes a fair bit out of the car battery so make sure the engine is running when you fire it up, once running, it doesn't take too much power.
Col
The unit may come with a tank, if not you can get them on e-bay. The tank goes under the bonnet and the pipe runs down the bulkhead. If you go for the air type look on the self build camper sites as there's a lot of info. You can make a metal box with vents to go under the rear floor then put a grill in the tub for the warm air. This keeps the heater and intake and all the fuel system outside. The Webasto ones shut off with enough power in the battery for an engine start. If can get hold of a working Webasto Thermotop from a breakers (they were fitted to Rover 75s) these can be wired to switch on a 12v supply, the BMW/VW ones need a canbus. The water ones are plumbed into the heater circuit so you get eh heat through the normal heater and fan (it has a fan output)
Decided to look and see what the installtion instructions are for the Chinese heaters. Very very differernt to the Webasto! Here is a photo from one of the sellers, I don't think this would be legal in the UK and its certainly not safe, fuel and heater next to each other and in the passenger compartment.
mick 1986
Well-Known Member
Decided to look and see what the installtion instructions are for the Chinese heaters. Very very differernt to the Webasto! Here is a photo from one of the sellers, I don't think this would be legal in the UK and its certainly not safe, fuel and heater next to each other and in the passenger compartment.
What makes that install “illegal”? What laws have been broken?
