frog hopper
Well-Known Member
Bloody hell !! that was quick.
Thanks very much for that, all good advice, and reassuring.
Thanks very much for that, all good advice, and reassuring.
frog hopper
Well-Known Member
Thread revival time, (though I've seen worse).
I have been gradually working my way through Buttercup's transmission, looking for the source of the noise, most work going on the "what did you do with your Range Rover" thread.
New VCU, old one was Snafu, new h/d prop U/J's, stripped and lubricated H' brake, checked brake mud shields, checked brakes all round and eventually decided to replace rear calipers as one piston was a bit reluctant to return off the disk.
No difference, noise still coming and going.
So this morning I decided to remove the H'brake shoes altogether to rule that out even though on inspection there looked to be no obvious wear points, put back together to trial her without H'brake shoes for a while.
Now here's the thing, while replacing the prop I noticed that the mudshield on the diff flange (part # FRC 8154 - I think) was loose on the flange shaft, cleaned up as best I could while still in place and think I can see some wear marks on the outer rim of the mudshield where it has been rubbing in the diff nose. So far this is the most obvious sign of contact wear I have seen in this whole saga, going to leave in place as is for the moment just to rule out the H'brake 1st. If noise is still there reassemble H'brake and remove diff flange mudshield to see what that does.
How important is the mudsield?, can I just bin it? or do I need to replace? is it worth replacing the input flange? as far as I know the flange itself is in good order as I replaced the oil seal last year and it looked OK then.
Anyway sorry for the long post, just a fair bit of back story to get us in the right order of things.
I have been gradually working my way through Buttercup's transmission, looking for the source of the noise, most work going on the "what did you do with your Range Rover" thread.
New VCU, old one was Snafu, new h/d prop U/J's, stripped and lubricated H' brake, checked brake mud shields, checked brakes all round and eventually decided to replace rear calipers as one piston was a bit reluctant to return off the disk.
No difference, noise still coming and going.
So this morning I decided to remove the H'brake shoes altogether to rule that out even though on inspection there looked to be no obvious wear points, put back together to trial her without H'brake shoes for a while.
Now here's the thing, while replacing the prop I noticed that the mudshield on the diff flange (part # FRC 8154 - I think) was loose on the flange shaft, cleaned up as best I could while still in place and think I can see some wear marks on the outer rim of the mudshield where it has been rubbing in the diff nose. So far this is the most obvious sign of contact wear I have seen in this whole saga, going to leave in place as is for the moment just to rule out the H'brake 1st. If noise is still there reassemble H'brake and remove diff flange mudshield to see what that does.
How important is the mudsield?, can I just bin it? or do I need to replace? is it worth replacing the input flange? as far as I know the flange itself is in good order as I replaced the oil seal last year and it looked OK then.
Anyway sorry for the long post, just a fair bit of back story to get us in the right order of things.
norseman
Well-Known Member
Too right it does, my '87 auto has the manual centre diff lock & having had a RRC with the BW setup I don't regret the lack of a VCU one little bit
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Datatek
Well-Known Member
Shame a transfer box with a proper diff lock instead of a VCU cannot be fitted to the ZF auto box in the P38Too right it does, my '87 still has the manual centre diff lock & having had a RRC with the BW setup I don't regret the lack of a VCU one little bit
norseman
Well-Known Member
Shame a transfer box with a proper diff lock instead of a VCU cannot be fitted to the ZF auto box in the P38
I've read/heard that LR went for the BW setup to reduce transmission whine from the T.box . Maybe it's because my RRC is still low mileage, but I can't say the slight background whine is in any way obtrusive, even at M/way speeds. More likely 'sales' decided that the omission of a device that actually needed some input from the driver would prove a selling point to perspective owners
Datatek
Well-Known Member
I'm sure you are right.I've read/heard that LR went for the BW setup to reduce transmission whine from the T.box . Maybe it's because my RRC is still low mileage, but I can't say the slight background whine is in any way obtrusive, even at M/way speeds. More likely 'sales' decided that the omission of a device that actually needed some input from the driver would prove a selling point to perspective owners
Shropshire classic
Active Member
Could be right about the reduction in driver input as a reason to move to the vcu as it was probably seen as a differentiator from the landis but I was always under the impression that it was the introduction of the chain drive in the transfer box that was there to reduce transmission whine
frog hopper
Well-Known Member
Many thanks for the replies guys, however the question remains - how important is the mudshield (FRC 8154) to the seal/bearing etc in the nose of the diff.?
When I take the prop off to reassemble the H'brake would be the logical time to remove the flange from the diff and chuck the mudshield. Need I replace it? I know it's only about £0.80 but postage is going to be £6, could I weld the shield I have onto the flange?
Another option of course while I'm underneath is just to replace the whole lot, flange/shield/oil-seal, then at least I can be fairly sure that will be sorted for the next few years.
When I take the prop off to reassemble the H'brake would be the logical time to remove the flange from the diff and chuck the mudshield. Need I replace it? I know it's only about £0.80 but postage is going to be £6, could I weld the shield I have onto the flange?
Another option of course while I'm underneath is just to replace the whole lot, flange/shield/oil-seal, then at least I can be fairly sure that will be sorted for the next few years.
Datatek
Well-Known Member
I assume that £6 is from the UK? Have you tried French suppliers?
www.Landers-Shop.fr www.Pieces-range-rover.com www.Landypoint.fr
70 nm is what my P38 manual took to turn the front wheel with a refurbed transfer box from Ashcrofts. You have to tease it round really slowly otherwise it clicks. My old one took 140nm but it wasn't seized, just hard to shift. It felt much smoother on the road afterwards and the scrubbing on the outside of the tyres stopped so it was worth doing.
I don't think the VCU should have any slip unless it has let go. I think I read somewhere that someone had had one just spin freely rather than seize but it might have been a Freelander thread. I'd be more worried about the clutch. My slave cylinder on the P38 has a spring inside. Is the Classic the same? Is there any movement before the clutch-pedal feels pressure?
frog hopper
Well-Known Member
Hi @Datatek , yes that would be from the UK, I do often price compare with Landypoint, a nice group of lads. The £6 was just a panic comment.
Hi @Grrrrrr . That was actually with the front prop removed.
With the new VCU installed and front prop replaced the clutch is performing as it should. (perhaps I should have whispered that - don't need any more krapton factor at the mo)
norseman
Well-Known Member
frog hopper
Well-Known Member
Right then, since removing the shoes from the H'brake the noises have stopped, so it looks as though that might well be the answer.
My problem now is that I want to put all back together with new shoes and return springs and really am not confident about the part numbers. I have looked through google and my parts book and if anything it has left me more confused than ever. There is a chance that a P O has replaced the handbrake shoes with the wrong ones, so maybe it's difficult for me to compare. Anyway, if I could call on the experience of @jamesmartin or anyone else with more knowledge than myself (not difficult) here are some references.
1988 (late) vin # ending FA351852 with BW tranny box # 003001019, LT77 G'box # 54A 00284915F, H'brake is cable operated with operating linkage and adjuster at approx 10 past 8 (as clock face) viewed from rear, no holes in back-plate for retaining pin/springs.
Part numbers I have finally come up with after conversations with Paddocks are ICW500010g for shoes and ICW100050 for spring kit, does this look right? do I just bin the retaining pin/springs and fit the rest? The return springs that were originally fitted were 2 long green ones which I now suspect to be wrong.
https://www.paddockspares.com/icw500010g-handbrake-shoes-cable-operated-mintex.html
https://www.paddockspares.com/icw10...retention-kit-inc-springs-cable-operated.html
Any help gratefully received thanks.
My problem now is that I want to put all back together with new shoes and return springs and really am not confident about the part numbers. I have looked through google and my parts book and if anything it has left me more confused than ever. There is a chance that a P O has replaced the handbrake shoes with the wrong ones, so maybe it's difficult for me to compare. Anyway, if I could call on the experience of @jamesmartin or anyone else with more knowledge than myself (not difficult) here are some references.
1988 (late) vin # ending FA351852 with BW tranny box # 003001019, LT77 G'box # 54A 00284915F, H'brake is cable operated with operating linkage and adjuster at approx 10 past 8 (as clock face) viewed from rear, no holes in back-plate for retaining pin/springs.
Part numbers I have finally come up with after conversations with Paddocks are ICW500010g for shoes and ICW100050 for spring kit, does this look right? do I just bin the retaining pin/springs and fit the rest? The return springs that were originally fitted were 2 long green ones which I now suspect to be wrong.
https://www.paddockspares.com/icw500010g-handbrake-shoes-cable-operated-mintex.html
https://www.paddockspares.com/icw10...retention-kit-inc-springs-cable-operated.html
Any help gratefully received thanks.
jamesmartin
Well-Known Member
you havent a pic of your back p-late
frog hopper
Well-Known Member
Will post some pics in the morning.
frog hopper
Well-Known Member
Pics of back plate.
I know the last one of the T'box is crap but thought I'd include it anyway.
Hope this is enough for you @jamesmartin ? cheers.
I know the last one of the T'box is crap but thought I'd include it anyway.
Hope this is enough for you @jamesmartin ? cheers.
frog hopper
Well-Known Member
Anyone else got any suggestions as to suitable shoes and springs for this backplate ???
