top-cat said:

Sorry if you thought i was having a pop.
I cant quote any refference other than a friend and neighbour left a van and trailer parked out side his home and it got hit by a drunk driver.
The police at the time told him that the vehicle (not just the trailer) would have had to have had its lights on as he was 100 yards outside the village thus on a country lane. if he parked it 100 yards further down he would be within the 30mph speed limit and in an area lit by street lights and would be ok. They didnt press charges against him as the driver that hit him was ****ed.
What i would assume with the op his trailer would have reflective markers on the back, like any vehicle so would be ok, i know skip companies place lights on the skips but usually only on main roads i assume because they dont have reflective markers on them.

Click to expand...

Top Cat,

Thanks for that.

Would have been a bit of a rum do if your neighbour had been charged.

I'm interested in following this thread because every now and again when I'm away overnight I just park the Freelander, with a loaded trailer attached, in the street like everyone else, without thinking about it.

I know our local council up here are dead against caravans parked in residential streets, but haven't a clue what the position is re small trailers.

Cheers,

S.

Did any1 suss this out?

I am watching intently too. I always though that Your ok in a village but out of a village you need lights just as in a car. As long as your trailer has refectors

Kizzeh said:

I am watching intently too. I always though that Your ok in a village but out of a village you need lights just as in a car. As long as your trailer has refectors

Click to expand...

Hmm I didnt have a thought either way really until i looked into it and the link i put in earlier, a legalitys section would be a good idea for the forum-aplace where you can look up anything to do with legals and driving, and i spose the off road side aswell...

thequeenscheese said:

Did any1 suss this out?

Click to expand...

Well .......Yes ......and ......No.

I've checked the Highways Agency leaflet 'Good to Tow', the Highway Code, and had a read of RVLR reg 24 & CUR reg 82. Also asked a pal who wears a uniform, shiny boots, and drives a car with a pretty blue light on top.

RVLR reg 24 para 1 says you must have all marker lights (front and tail lights) and rear number-plate light illuminated on a public road between sunset and sunrise. You do need lights

Then para 5 says that if its basically a car or a light commercial vehicle parked in a 30 limit facing the right way etc then para 1 does not apply. You don't need lights

But then it goes on to say in para 6 that the exemption in para 5 does not apply if a trailer is attached. So you do need lights after all

So there is the letter of the law - technically - but practically ......

I think it would be a very officious copper who decided off his own bat to book you for leaving a Freelander hitched to a small trailer without lights in a 30 limit street where other cars were parked.

So there you have it -But if you have bloody-minded neighbours, you could well have a copper at the door saying "We have received a complaint."

Bit of a gamble isn't it?

I'm disappointed with what I found out. I must be careful in future.

Singvogel.

i think the answer as you suggested earlier get a bike light on the back we used to have to have parking lights in the 60's then somewhere along the line the law changed better to be safe than nicked

teddywood1 said:

i think the answer as you suggested earlier get a bike light on the back we used to have to have parking lights in the 60's then somewhere along the line the law changed better to be safe than nicked

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i think your right, because i know for certain the battery would not last all night never mind starting aswell, and on that basis it isnt possible to be law abiding along with the fact that ive asked a few trailer shops and they do not make such a light for that purpose and i bike light will be fine im sure but its not for that job, so i wonder where you stand as it isnt actually possible to do what is asked by the law especially if it does require the tow vehicle to be lit also..?

and the last 2 reg above contradict themselves...at least the european law hasnt got involded yet either lol

look on the highway code i think it is rule 217 what I can gather you are ok to park a trailer without lights if you are in a 30mph zone but must be the right way round hope this helps

teddywood1 said:

look on the highway code i think it is rule 217 what I can gather you are ok to park a trailer without lights if you are in a 30mph zone but must be the right way round hope this helps

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Sorry teddy - but that's not quite right.

Rule 217 is about displaying 'new driver' plates.

Rule 250 is the one that concerns lights at night.
Cars, goods vehicles not exceeding 1525 kg unladen weight, invalid carriages, motorcycles and pedal cycles may be parked without lights on a road (or lay-by) with a speed limit of 30 mph (48 km/h) or less if they are
at least 10 metres (32 feet) away from any junction, close to the kerb and facing in the direction of the traffic flow
in a recognised parking place or lay-by
Other vehicles and trailers, and all vehicles with projecting loads, MUST NOT be left on a road at night without lights.

Highway Code rule 250 comes from this legislation -
[Laws RVLR reg 24 & CUR reg 82(7)]

This is what I quoted before and after checking even deeper it means vehicles with a trailer attached must have all lights too.

It seems there are absolutely no exceptions - for little trailers, bike trailers etc. Parked trailers must have lights if parked at at night on any road whether coupled to vehicles or not.

In places where you could park a car without lights quite legally, if you had a tiny trailer coupled up, you would need all tail lights on the trailer, including number plate lights, and all front lights on the car too.

Seems crazy but that's it - no exemptions.

I don't like this law - but what can we do about it?

Singvogel.

In places where you could park a car without lights quite legally, if you had a tiny trailer coupled up, you would need all tail lights on the trailer, including number plate lights, and all front lights on the car too.

Seems crazy but that's it - no exemptions.

I don't like this law - but what can we do about it?

Singvogel.[/quote]

well this is impossible as the battery would not last out the night, does the landyzone carry any weight anywhere to find an actual clarification on this?

I think this might be a miss interpretation of the line that states "Other vehicles and trailers"
I read it as "other vehicles" meaning those not listed above, and "and trailers" meaning un-conected trailers.
That would mean if you have a connected trailer it is ok to park on a well lit road that carries a 30mph speed limit.
I know by law if you drop a skip on the road outside your house you must illuminate it at night because it has no reflectors or lights.

Right, i'm all out of 2 penny pieces.

bye

Is it against the law to park up at the side of the road for a break, or to go into a shop, or stop to ask directions. The rules quoted MUST apply to trailers not hooked up to vehicles, otherwise we would all get tickets the moment we stopped driving.

siblo said:

Is it against the law to park up at the side of the road for a break, or to go into a shop, or stop to ask directions. The rules quoted MUST apply to trailers not hooked up to vehicles, otherwise we would all get tickets the moment we stopped driving.

Click to expand...

Perhaps you have misunderstood me - of course you can stop for any reason you like - but the law says that you must leave the lights on if you have a trailer between sunset and sunrise.

S.

thequeenscheese said:

well this is impossible as the battery would not last out the night, does the landyzone carry any weight anywhere to find an actual clarification on this?

Click to expand...

I agree - but it's not clarification that we need - it's the law to be changed - that's why I said 'what can we do' - as we have no clout at all.

The law doesn't want you to leave a trailer, with or without a towing vehicle on the road all night.

The law doesn't prohibit leaving it - just makes it impossible as like you say the battery wont last the night, with full side-lights left on.

My polizei pal says he had fun yesterday checking with his mates about it in the canteen. Very few knew the regs straight off. But the conclusion was as I posted before. You must have lights showing on any trailer from sunset to sunrise on any road, whether a 30 limit or not - street lights or not.

The law is an ass, innit.

Singvogel.

It must be linked to some form of taxing/insurance type clause - when we had our caravan we parked it outside the day before departing to load up and charge up/get the fridge cold for beer. Never had an issue with that. The previous owner had fitted LED marker lights to the caravan which worked off the side lights or when disconnected, the leisure battery - I wonder if this was the reason.

However there is something like if you park anything on a road with a speed limit greater than 30mph at night, it must be lit.

Cheap cycle lights are the way forward.

if yer can see day light either side of the trailer in your mirrors it will go in

...if yer trailers hitched to yer motor its now part of your car and is treated as so, insured also. its just like parking a long car, as long as its not by double yellows or blocking access yer ok. my plant trailer 14ft, three sankeys and a small half tonne trailers all parked on the road with no complaints. as long as it has reflectors, if they cant see it they shouldnt be behind the wheel,

well this is the official response that ive recieved and attachment:

Dear John

Thank you for your email of 13 April to our Contactdft inbox, concerning parking your trailer on the road whilst it is hitched to your vehicle, either during the day or at night. This has been subsequently forwarded to the International Vehicle & Standards Division as we have policy responsibility for vehicle safety and as such I have been asked to reply.

I enclose our Information Sheet on trailers which will be of help to you.

I also give you the web link for the trailer lighting, The Road Vehicles Lighting Regulation 1989, SI No 1796.
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1989/1796/contents/made

As for the matter of parking facing oncoming traffic and double parking, I attach the weblink for the Highway Code. Waiting and parking (238-252) : Directgov - Travel and transport.

Kind regards




Fran Simpson
Department for Transport
International Vehicle Standards
Zone 1/33
Great Minster House
33 Horseferry Road
London
SW1P 4DR

ATTACHMENT:

Requirements for Trailers

Statement

Requirements regarding trailers used on the road are given in the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986, as amended (C&U) and the Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 1989, as amended (RVLR). The following is a summary of the main requirements.

Every effort has been made to ensure that it is factually correct but recipients should check with the producers of this document if they are unsure about the validity of a particular regulation after the date of publication or if they have reason to believe any part is not correct or is now out of date.

1 Weight

In the case of light trailers, that are less than 3500kg in maximum laden weight, there is not any specified relationship in UK law between the weight of the towing vehicle and the weight of the trailer.

For M1 category vehicles (motor vehicles used for the carriage of passengers and comprising not more than eight seats in addition to the driver’s seat) the maximum permissible trailer weight may be quoted by the vehicle manufacturer. Alternatively, the vehicle manufacturer may provide a maximum gross train weight (the laden weight of the trailer plus the laden weight of the towing vehicle). If either of these weights are exceeded it is possible that the Courts or Insurance Companies may take the view that this constitutes a danger.

The maximum laden weight of a trailer which may be towed by an M1 or a light goods vehicle depends on
(a) the stated gross train weight of the towing vehicle (GTW) and/or
(b) the vehicle manufacturer’s recommended maximum permissible trailer weight.
Neither the maximum permissible trailer weight nor the maximum gross train weight (the laden weight of the trailer plus the laden weight of the towing vehicle) should be exceeded.

It is possible that the stated gross train weight is less than the sum of the stated maximum permissible laden weight of the towing vehicle and the stated maximum permissible laden trailer weight. In this case the towing vehicle and the trailer must be loaded such that each does not exceed its individual maximum limit and the sum of both does not exceed the maximum gross train weight.

It is not a requirement to display a notice of the unladen weight of the trailer or the towing vehicle, unless the towing vehicle is either a motor tractor or a locomotive, as defined in the C&U.

2 Dimensions

If the towing vehicle has a permissible gross weight in excess of 3.5 tonnes the maximum width and length of the trailer are 2.55 metres and 12 metres respectively. If however the gross weight of the towing vehicle is 3.5 tonnes or less, then the maximum permissible width and length for a drawbar trailer are 2.55 metres and 7 metres respectively. In both cases, the overall length of the towing vehicle and trailer must not exceed either 18m or 18.75m depending on the type of towing vehicle. If the vehicle combination (not including buses) is of the articulated category the maximum permissible width and length of the semi-trailer are 2.55 metres and 12.2 metres respectively. The overall length of the towing vehicle and trailer must not exceed 15.5m .

The C&U definition of the overall length of a trailer makes it clear that the coupling device and draw-bar are not included in the length dimension. In the case of a caravan, where a protective box is mounted on to the front (for example to hold gas storage tanks) and is supported on the draw-bar, this box is included in the overall length.

These requirements also apply to visiting vehicles. Under Regulation 4(4) Item 2 of C&U, we permit a vehicle to be brought into Great Britain by a person resident abroad, provided that the vehicle complies in every respect with the requirements relating to motor vehicles or trailers contained in:

(a) article 21 and paragraph (1) of article 22 of the Convention on Road Traffic concluded at Geneva on September 19, 1949 and Part I, Part II (so far as it relates to direction indicators and stoplamps) and Part III of Annex 6 to that Convention; or
(b) paragraphs I, III and VIII of article 3 of the International Convention relative to Motor Traffic concluded at Paris on April 24, 1926.

Therefore we provide visiting vehicles an exemption from the construction, equipment and maintenance of vehicle requirements specified in Part II of C&U but not from the requirements for Regulations 7, 8, and 10, which relate to length, width and height respectively.

There is significant harmonisation of regulation within the European Union and freedom of movement across borders. European Council Directive 96/53/EC, Annex I, states the maximum authorised dimensions for certain road vehicles circulating within the Community. However Annex I relates to large passenger carrying vehicles, large goods vehicles and trailers with a weight of over 3500 kg. There are no specific requirements for light vehicles.

Article 3(2) permits Member States to require vehicles, not covered by Annex I, put into circulation in their own territory, to be in conformity with their own national requirements.

The UK is permitted to refuse to admit vehicles into the UK if the dimensions exceed limits fixed by the domestic legislation.

3 Brakes

Braking requirements are prescribed in Regulations 15 and 16 of C&U:

• A trailer with a maximum design laden weight of more than 750 kg must be braked
• An inertia (overrun) type braking system may be used up to a maximum permissible laden weight of 3500kg .
• It is not permitted to use an unbraked trailer, the laden weight of which exceeds 50% of the kerbside weight of the towing vehicle.
• The braking system must be fitted with a device to stop the trailer automatically in the event of separation of the main coupling. This is normally achieved by a breakaway cable attached to the parking brake mechanism which applies the brakes when the trailer becomes detached from the towing vehicle. However, for trailers up to 1500kg laden weight, it is permitted to use a secondary coupling (chain, wire rope, etc) which in the event of separation of the main coupling, will retain the trailer attached to the towing vehicle, prevent the nose of the trailer from touching the ground and provide some residual steering of the trailer.
• An inertia braking system must allow the trailer to be reversed with the towing vehicle without imposing a sustained drag force exceeding 8% of the technically permissible maximum mass of the trailer. Devices used for this purpose must act automatically and disengage automatically when the trailer moves forward.

4 Lights

The requirements for trailer lighting can be found in The Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 1989 as amended (SI No.1796). A copy can be obtained from The Stationery Office, or see Section 7 below.

5 Suspension and Wings

Most trailers will need to be equipped with suitable suspension between each wheel and the frame of the vehicle as required by C&U Regulation 22. They will also require wings or other similar fittings to catch mud, water, etc thrown up by the rotation of its wheels as required by C&U Regulation 63. .

6 Coupling devices (Towbars)

Any coupling device fitted to a passenger carrying vehicle with up to eight seats plus the driver that:

a) has European Whole Vehicle Type Approval (ECWVTA) and
b) that the manufacturer has authorised to tow a trailer and
c) is first registered on or after 1 August 1998

must be type approved in accordance with EU Directive 94/20/EC. (Regulation 86B of C&U)

Modification to the coupling in any way, for example, by the addition of other devices that alter the position of the centre of a coupling ball, will render the approval invalid unless the coupling device manufacturer has taken this into account during approval of the device. You will need to consult the manufacturer for advice.

A vehicle that has ECWVTA will have a Vehicle Identification Number plate (VIN plate) bearing the vehicle manufacturer’s name, chassis number and an approval number including the letter ”e” in a small rectangle.

If the manufacturer has not authorised the towing of a trailer by declaration during the type approval process, it is not permitted to fit a coupling device or tow a trailer.

7 Legislation

The Regulations referred to above may be obtained through The Stationery Office (TSO) under the references, SI 1986 No.1078 for the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations and SI 1989 No. 1796 for the Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations. However, there have been many amendments to these base Regulations and it is important to obtain all of these in order to be aware of the current situation.

As an alternative, you may find it easier to visit a good, city based, reference library where a publication such as The Encyclopaedia of Road Traffic Law and Practice, published by Sweet and Maxwell, may be available. This publication tracks the amendments to legislation and presents them in a consolidated and up-dated form. One of the volumes will contain both the Construction and Use and Lighting Regulations.

TSO Orders/Post Cash Department Tel: 0870 600 5522
PO Box 29 Fax: 0870 600 5533
Norwich Email: customer.services@tso.co.uk
NR3 1GN Website: www.tsoshop.co.uk

The RVLR amendments together with amendments to C&U from 1988 can be found as Statutory Instruments on the following web site: www.opsi.gov.uk/legislation

European Union legislation can be found on the European Union Law website at http://eur-lex.europa.eu/en/index.htm.




8 Other considerations

The above information relates to basic construction requirements and some aspects of the use of trailers. In addition it is recommended that you check whether you have the appropriate Driving Licence entitlement and whether the vehicle or combination of vehicles requires a tachograph to record driver’s hours. The latter will apply to most vehicles and combinations of vehicles above 3500kg gross weight, where used for commercial purposes.

For Driving Licence enquiries contact:
DVLA Customer Enquiries, Telephone 0300 790 6801

Further details are available at: www.direct.gov.uk

For Tachograph requirement enquiries contact:
Vehicle and Operator Services Agency, Telephone: 0300 123 9000

Further details are available at: http://www.dft.gov.uk/vosa/

Further information
If you require any further information regarding the content of this fact sheet, please contact the DfT at the address below:

International Vehicle Standards
Department for Transport
Zone 1/33
Great Minster House Telephone: 020 7944 2091
33 Horseferry Road
London Email: TTS.enquiries@dft.gsi.gov.uk
SW1P 4DR


NOTE: The information in this document is a summary of the Department’s understanding of what the law requires. However, ultimately the interpretation of the law is a matter for the courts based on individual facts of any particular case. You are therefore advised to consult the relevant legislation and, if necessary, seek independent advice.

Singvogel said:

I agree - but it's not clarification that we need - it's the law to be changed - that's why I said 'what can we do' - as we have no clout at all.

The law doesn't want you to leave a trailer, with or without a towing vehicle on the road all night.

The law doesn't prohibit leaving it - just makes it impossible as like you say the battery wont last the night, with full side-lights left on.

My polizei pal says he had fun yesterday checking with his mates about it in the canteen. Very few knew the regs straight off. But the conclusion was as I posted before. You must have lights showing on any trailer from sunset to sunrise on any road, whether a 30 limit or not - street lights or not.

The law is an ass, innit.

Singvogel.

Click to expand...

another point why dont hgv's has a system in place for this as i havnt seen one of these artics with there lights on at night anywhere in a layby or not and if nthis is the law as it seems it is wouldnt the industry have invested in a system for fitting/built into lorries for this as it is a regular occurance for them to park with a trailer attached?

:fighting2::fighting2:

thequeenscheese said:

another point why dont hgv's has a system in place for this as i havnt seen one of these artics with there lights on at night anywhere in a layby or not and if nthis is the law as it seems it is wouldnt the industry have invested in a system for fitting/built into lorrys for this as it is a regular occurance for them to park with a trailer attached?

:fighting2::fighting2:

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Lorries do have to be marked at night, you must not see many lorries, all the ones I see are lit up like Xmas trees

Chrisfrain2007 said:

Lorries do have to be marked at night, you must not see many lorries, all the ones I see are lit up like Xmas trees

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well try driving over the woodhead pass from manchester to sheffield and i think ull see more than the 1 you must have looked at none of them light up and i imagine some of them would suffer the same problem of a flat bat if they did.

Did you think i was making it up?

Either way they dont have a night light system which if you read properly you would have picked up on this.