styleruk said:
I was at a local jumble sale by our scout hut saturday and some **** moved the cones that were put there to stop people driving on the very boggy field next to the hard standing car park. then they drove their transit custom that must have weighed 2 tonnes and got very stuck. They buried their front down so much that the engine sump was buried.
As I walked past him, he shouted out the window, 'give you £50 to pull me out', I said no chance. firstly, I don't have a tow rope and secondly, he can stay there and wait for recovery and think about life choices.
That got me thinking, if I had a rope I would have helped of course, but I don't. So I was going to buy a decent tow rope or cable to put in the back for those special occasions.
Anyone want to share what they got? If I google it, I just get a ton of **** adverts for random ropes that may or may not be great.

PS: scout hut people were very ****ed off with him as he left a long deep trench in their nice field.
Click to expand...
Depends what you want to use the rope for really.

Do NOT use chains or cables unless you want to injure or kill someone!!

A recovery rope should be used for recovery not a tow rope. Usually recovery ropes have a bit of stretch and give to reduce shock loading.

Straps and stropes are not so good either as most have no stretch, so very high shock loading. They can be ok as a towing device, but not recovery. There are some stretchy Kinetic staps these days. Advantage is they are more compact to carry, but have a limited number of uses before the stretch is all gone, at that point they need throwing away.

Kinetic ropes work differently and can be used many times with no limit bar general wear and tear.

As you don't want things breaking, higher load ratings are better than low ones. A 1" diameter rope as a min would be a suggestion. Not the string type ones you might see at Halfords.

A longer rope can be handy as you can always double it back to make it shorter.

You will need a way to attach the rope to a vehicle, quality rated D or Bow shackles can be used. But only use them to join a rope to vehicle, never to join two ropes together.

Soft shackles are great too, but should only be used on rounded edges. Sharp corners or edges will run the risk of cutting through it.

Also make sure you use quality recovery points. Lashing eyes are normally not strong enough and you should use high tensile (8.8 or higher) bolts.
 
Hicap phill said:
Also attaching to tow ball can break the ball off.
Click to expand...
I would question this statement.

In some parts of the world it is common to see tow balls like this:
1712840517529.png

1712840536057.png


These do have potential to break and shear off, although it is usually unlikely.

In the UK such tow balls are not as common, we tend to have things like this:
1712840639605.png

and this:
1712840673689.png


I have never heard of these failing or snapping. And indeed such tow balls are rated at competition level for 4x4 recovery (assuming the sharp edges have been removed).
 
300bhp/ton said:
I would question this statement.

In some parts of the world it is common to see tow balls like this:
View attachment 314717
View attachment 314718

These do have potential to break and shear off, although it is usually unlikely.

In the UK such tow balls are not as common, we tend to have things like this:
View attachment 314719
and this:
View attachment 314720

I have never heard of these failing or snapping. And indeed such tow balls are rated at competition level for 4x4 recovery (assuming the sharp edges have been removed).
Click to expand...
If you see a recovery point on completion motors they are lay down so the forces have changed. (On front of motor)
Rear normally is a jaw/ball type. I always use the jaw,saves on removing the rope after live recovery while racing

Forces change when a motor is snatched and this causes failure. Tow balls are rated for a gentle pull
 
Hicap phill said:
If you see a recovery point on completion motors they are lay down so the forces have changed. (On front of motor)
Rear normally is a jaw/ball type. I always use the jaw,saves on removing the rope after live recovery while racing

Forces change when a motor is snatched and this causes failure. Tow balls are rated for a gentle pull
Click to expand...
I like Nato hooks myself. But the tow balls of the design noted above are used for competition use including snatch recoveries for Team Recovery events. e.g.

1712845406992.png
 
Towballs are designed to carry just a few hundred Kg's.
What's holding your towball on ?
What is is held on to ?

2 x M12 10.9 bolts ? (about 4 tonne ?)
new 3mm mild steel plate ? (about 2 tonne ?)
Rusty defender rear X-member (less than 2 tonne ?)

I/Me, personally, would never, ever, ever use a tow ball on a vehicle as a recovery point, but I would tow using one.
 
miktdish said:
Towballs are designed to carry just a few hundred Kg's.
What's holding your towball on ?
What is is held on to ?

2 x M12 10.9 bolts ? (about 4 tonne ?)
new 3mm mild steel plate ? (about 2 tonne ?)
Rusty defender rear X-member (less than 2 tonne ?)

I/Me, personally, would never, ever, ever use a tow ball on a vehicle as a recovery point, but I would tow using one.
Click to expand...
That's a fair point, don't think I'd chance it in the future unless it's just a simple pull to gain traction or something. Besides, my 1985 90 with petrol engine will struggle to pull the skin off a rice pudding, so don't really want to go having a tug of war with anything. But may consider towing a townie out of a puddle one day.
 
300bhp/ton said:
Depends what you want to use the rope for really.

Do NOT use chains or cables unless you want to injure or kill someone!!

A recovery rope should be used for recovery not a tow rope. Usually recovery ropes have a bit of stretch and give to reduce shock loading.

Straps and stropes are not so good either as most have no stretch, so very high shock loading. They can be ok as a towing device, but not recovery. There are some stretchy Kinetic staps these days. Advantage is they are more compact to carry, but have a limited number of uses before the stretch is all gone, at that point they need throwing away.

Kinetic ropes work differently and can be used many times with no limit bar general wear and tear.

As you don't want things breaking, higher load ratings are better than low ones. A 1" diameter rope as a min would be a suggestion. Not the string type ones you might see at Halfords.

A longer rope can be handy as you can always double it back to make it shorter.

You will need a way to attach the rope to a vehicle, quality rated D or Bow shackles can be used. But only use them to join a rope to vehicle, never to join two ropes together.

Soft shackles are great too, but should only be used on rounded edges. Sharp corners or edges will run the risk of cutting through it.

Also make sure you use quality recovery points. Lashing eyes are normally not strong enough and you should use high tensile (8.8 or higher) bolts.
Click to expand...
All good info, cheers.
 
miktdish said:
Towballs are designed to carry just a few hundred Kg's.
What's holding your towball on ?
What is is held on to ?

2 x M12 10.9 bolts ? (about 4 tonne ?)
new 3mm mild steel plate ? (about 2 tonne ?)
Rusty defender rear X-member (less than 2 tonne ?)

I/Me, personally, would never, ever, ever use a tow ball on a vehicle as a recovery point, but I would tow using one.
Click to expand...
The recovery point needs to be suitable, regardless of the final rope attachment point. 6-10mm thick plate behind the rear cross member works and high tensile fixings.

The ALRC/ARC have been running off roading events for about 60 years. We are one of the largest motorsports organisers in the country accounting for around percent of all the off road permits issued by the MSUK each year. Tow balls and fitments to Land Rover's have been proven and tested 1000's of times in competition over the years. Hence the fact they are allowed and recommended.
 
About ten years ago while myself and a friend were setting out a 4x4 trial he got his trials truck stuck down to the belly in sand quarry washings pit when it broke through the hardened surface. No one else to help so we joined our tow ropes so as to have enough length for my Ninety to be on solid ground.
A tug was of no use or even a couple of fair yanks. Knowing my trucks chassis was in good order I decided to go for it using the tow ball. This got him out of the mire. The tow ball had taken the strain but both its bolts had bent some!!! And had to be replaced. [ So was the ball]
Decided to never try that again but was pleased the Landy took the strain.
Struts from the rear of ball to chassis do spread the load.
 
I would add I use the liting straps/strops as static pulls, I.e no dynamic or kinetic loading.

I do actually always have an old climbing rope to use as the length can come in handy, they are massively rated, and they do have a fair amount of stretch in them, unless something is totally bogged most rated things will do the job fine, I also have a couple of snatch blocks which can be used as re-directs or to pull something sideways, these are fantastic for doubling the pulling power to.
 
300bhp/ton said:
The recovery point needs to be suitable, regardless of the final rope attachment point. 6-10mm thick plate behind the rear cross member works and high tensile fixings.

The ALRC/ARC have been running off roading events for about 60 years. We are one of the largest motorsports organisers in the country accounting for around percent of all the off road permits issued by the MSUK each year. Tow balls and fitments to Land Rover's have been proven and tested 1000's of times in competition over the years. Hence the fact they are allowed and recommended.
Click to expand...
And Malcom still builds nice motors…
Has he retired yet?
 
Hi all

This is going to be a daft question for you experts I know.

I've recently bought 2.4 Puma, it's come with what I assume is a factory fitted standard tow bar, the sort you'd use to tow a caravan (I am not a caravanophile).

I know nothing about towing but I do know you are never supposed to use tow bars for vehicle recovery as they are not designed for that level of load, and nobody wants a steel ball in the noggin.

Where are the standard recovery points on the Defender to say attach a bog standard tow rope should I need to pull a broken down friends car off the side of the road etc? I am not talking off-road recovery, just the usual 'stick it in the boot just in case' scenario.

Would I need to purchase some jate rings and screw them into the chassis in place of where the standard lashing eyes are, or is there a standard 'on road' recovery point on the vehicle already?

This is the back of my vehicle. Like I said, I know naff all about tow bars and will likely never use it.
 

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I too am certainly no towing expert and I don't want to be either, so I'll leave the correct answer to them and explain what I think.
For recovering my own vehicle when it broke down (wiring issues fixed now), I went out and brought 2 of the jate rings, see pic. There are locations on the back for these, I considered it, but then thought about what other people said about towing people out. So I stuck them both on the front in the view to use them 'to be' recovered rather than recover people. That said, if someone I know needed pulling out of a ditch, I'd use them carefully, so I have a tow strap in the car ready...but probably for when I break down again....
The negatives I took are, especially if you don't know them, liability. Yes we live in the world of liability and towing someone out of a deep puddle because they were stupid enough to go into it in the first place begs the questions, 'why should I tow an idiot out'. They are just a likely to sue you if you bend something.
Naturally, if it's a friend, and you are careful, then fine. But I'm sticking with towing someone out backwards if the need arises. Maybe I'll record them on my phone saying 'I do not hold you liable for any damage'.

Meanwhile, I'll think about fitting two to the rear. One thing I know is to not use the welded on (seemingly tow hooks), they are for strapping down. That said, I got recovered by my brothers and he pulled from these... I wouldn't.

IMG_20240825_123842899_MP.jpg
 
johnnymarrsbarres said:
Hi all

This is going to be a daft question for you experts I know.

I've recently bought 2.4 Puma, it's come with what I assume is a factory fitted standard tow bar, the sort you'd use to tow a caravan (I am not a caravanophile).

I know nothing about towing but I do know you are never supposed to use tow bars for vehicle recovery as they are not designed for that level of load, and nobody wants a steel ball in the noggin.

Where are the standard recovery points on the Defender to say attach a bog standard tow rope should I need to pull a broken down friends car off the side of the road etc? I am not talking off-road recovery, just the usual 'stick it in the boot just in case' scenario.

Would I need to purchase some jate rings and screw them into the chassis in place of where the standard lashing eyes are, or is there a standard 'on road' recovery point on the vehicle already?

This is the back of my vehicle. Like I said, I know naff all about tow bars and will likely never use it.
Click to expand...
What tow ball do you have and how is it fitted? By and large most UK spec towballs fitted to Land Rovers are more than strong enough for recovery. And for "towing a friends car off the side of the road" the towball would generally be ideal.

If towing on the road a tow bar can be very useful, else a kinetic rope or strop.

EDIT: just noticed your picture. Assuming it is installed correctly with high tensile nuts & bolts (should be stamped 8.8 on the head), then that would be absolutely fine for recovery purposes on or off road.
 
300bhp/ton said:
What tow ball do you have and how is it fitted? By and large most UK spec towballs fitted to Land Rovers are more than strong enough for recovery. And for "towing a friends car off the side of the road" the towball would generally be ideal.

If towing on the road a tow bar can be very useful, else a kinetic rope or strop.

EDIT: just noticed your picture. Assuming it is installed correctly with high tensile nuts & bolts (should be stamped 8.8 on the head), then that would be absolutely fine for recovery purposes on or off road.
Click to expand...
Thanks, much appreciated.
 
Fully agree with @300bhp/ton above, the only time I have seen a tow ball come off [scary stuff in that it flew a hundred yards until it crashed into a tree] was because incorrect undersize bolts had been used.
If someone needs a car pulled out of a ditch say and they have lost the tow eye or fitting is suspect on the A arm strut next to the point it is fitted to body is the strongest point, preferably to both sides if bogged.
 
tottot said:
Fully agree with @300bhp/ton above, the only time I have seen a tow ball come off [scary stuff in that it flew a hundred yards until it crashed into a tree] was because incorrect undersize bolts had been used.
If someone needs a car pulled out of a ditch say and they have lost the tow eye or fitting is suspect on the A arm strut next to the point it is fitted to body is the strongest point, preferably to both sides if bogged.
Click to expand...
Of course let them attach the straps to the car. No way am I bending down and getting muddy for someone else’s stupidity
 
I have used the standard lashing eyes to tow for recovery in a road situation, so would expect a towball to be man enough to tow a rolling car with no issue.

Each situation is different. But if its just normal I.E not stuck in mud, then you have enough to help a stranded friend to safety.

As long as your bit of string is up for the job;).

J
 
Here's a clearer photo of the back of my car. It's a genuine Land Rover part - it's got these rings attached to it, would it be safe to attach a bow shackle to these for recovery, or would I still be better off just attaching the loop of a tow strap directly to the tow ball? If not, I am intrigued as to what those rings are for!


Screenshot 2024-10-29 at 18.02.40.png
 
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