Alibro
Well-Known Member
Good luck from me too, you'll be going well if you do it in a day, it took me closer to three days as it's a biggy.
Edit, Copied and pasted from here. https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/clutch-change-in-a-td4-list-of-jobs-to-do.315242/
Hi Guys, I replaced the clutch in my TD4 recently and took note of the list of jobs to do. Not many photo's I'm afraid but hopefully enough. This was how I did it, I'm not claiming it is the right way or best way but it worked for me. It would be great if others shared their experience and maybe say where I could have done it better or easier. Make sure you have the Rave manual open (at page 627 I think) for the correct procedure.
I didn't undo the lower ball joints on the wishbones as I didn't want to damage them and they didn't pop out by hammering the end of the strut so I unbolted the wishbones at the rear bush and front pivot bolt. This meant I could get the drive shafts out by pulling the whole strut out. It might have been easier if I had loosened the nuts on the top of the struts but it worked anyway.
0. Unbolt propshaft from IRD and tie up.
1. Disconect battery and unbolt the battery tray.
2. Remove engine cover and air duct feed to the EGR.
3. Remove starter motor (I just took the bolts out and left it sitting.)
4. Jack the front of the car up as high as you can and get it on axle stands
5. Take the wheels off.
6. Take the undertray and side panels off.
7. Drain the coolant.
8. Drain the gearbox oil. Not sure if it must be done but I was intending to change the oil anyway.
9. Unbolt the wishbones front and rear supports and leave them still attached to the ball joints but supported on a bungie.
10. Unbolt the lower end of both drop links.
11. Remove the two remaining bolts holding the subframe and it should drop down. (Note I had sprayed around the mounts with paint earlier so that I could see where they should go when refitting).
12. Using a pry bar pop the drive shafts out. The struts should swing out enough to let you get them out of the way but you might need to turn the steering to get the upper ball joints in the right position or they can hold them back. Support them with a bungie and pull an old rubber glove or similar over the ends to protect them from dirt. I also jammed clean rags into the drive shaft sockets.
13. Release the two coolant hoses on the IRD and catch what water is still in the system. (note this might be easier done after lowering the engine but this was when I did it)
14. Pull the breather pipe out of the top of the IRD.
15. Remove the bolts holding the lower engine tie bar and remove the tie bar.
16. Remove the lower tie bar brackets and RHS IRD bolts.
17. Remove the four bolts holding the IRD to the gearbox (the top two are very awkward and will need a swivel on a long extension bar) and wrestle it off the splines, it’s very heavy, be careful. (Note this is the order Rave says but it might be easier to lower the engine first)
Now would be a good time to drain the IRD oil if it hasn’t been done in a long time.
18. Disconnect the clutch hydrolic line at the connection just above the gearbox. It has a plastic sleeve which slides in to release the connection and out to secure it (a bit like fuel line connections). I used very long nose pointy pliers to squeeze the sleeve in and release it.
19. Disconnect the first and reverse gear electrical sensor connections.
20. Pop the gear linkage ball joints at the gearbox end. I used a claw hammer for this which worked well, I didn’t take the linkage off even though Rave says you should. It made removing the gearbox a bit more awkward but still do-able. As I had removed the subframe and dropped the engine a bit I had just enough room.
20a. Unhook the front two exhaust support rubbers. (Rave says to unbolt it from the manifold but I didn't need to)
21. Find some way to support the engine as the next step is to unbolt the N/S engine/gearbox mount. I used an engine hoist and lowered the sump onto a piece of wood that was on a milk crate.
I had the inlet manifold off too but this shouldn't be necessary, I was doing other stuff at the same time.
22. Remove the N/S engine mount and allow the engine/gearbox to sag down onto a support (approx 2-3 inches).
23. Remove the support bracket from the gearbox.
24. Attach a hoist to the gearbox. (I used an eye on the top of the gearbox)
25. Remove the bolts holding the gearbox to the engine.
26. Remove the small bolt that was behind the IRD (10mm) holding the thin metal plate to the gearbox. I hadn’t done this and the plate caught on a dowel causeing a bit of grief until I realised what was happening..
27. Lever the gearbox off the engine and wriggle it out of the gap. The gear linkage will catch on the chassis leg but if the engine has been lowered enough it should come out with a bit of twisting and pulling. I used an engine hoist to support it and lower it down, If you don’t have one then you’ll need help.
28. Replace the slave cylinder and thrust bearing.
29. Remove the pressure plate and friction plate.
30. At this stage I cleaned the flywheel and scuffed it a bit with a wire wheel on a grinder. I didn’t replace the fly wheel, maybe I should have but it wasn’t showing any signs of failure and felt tight when I checked it. Time will tell if this was a stupid thing to do but I didn’t fancy paying out another £300 for a new flywheel. Some say the flywheel should last as long as two clutches, I hope they’re right.
31. Bolt on the new clutch parts making sure the friction plate is centred. I cobbled together a tool to do this using a roll of tape and a couple of sockets. Allan bolts should be 25Nm, don’t know if it was overkill but I used threadlock.
Once in and the bolts tightened a bit I double checked checked the friction plate was centred by measuring from the centreing tool I'd thrown together. (a 1/2" socket adapter with some tape wrapped round it
32. Refit everything in reverse order.
I used a trolley jack to lift the IRD into position before raising the engine and gearbox. I think it was easier to access the bolts with the engine lowered.
I should have refitted the IRD breather too but forgot and only remembered while typing this up. Doh!
33. Bleed the clutch.
At this point hopefully you have a good working clutch, unfortunately my master cylinder gave up while bleeding so I'm waiting for a new one.
Edit, Copied and pasted from here. https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/clutch-change-in-a-td4-list-of-jobs-to-do.315242/
Hi Guys, I replaced the clutch in my TD4 recently and took note of the list of jobs to do. Not many photo's I'm afraid but hopefully enough. This was how I did it, I'm not claiming it is the right way or best way but it worked for me. It would be great if others shared their experience and maybe say where I could have done it better or easier. Make sure you have the Rave manual open (at page 627 I think) for the correct procedure.
I didn't undo the lower ball joints on the wishbones as I didn't want to damage them and they didn't pop out by hammering the end of the strut so I unbolted the wishbones at the rear bush and front pivot bolt. This meant I could get the drive shafts out by pulling the whole strut out. It might have been easier if I had loosened the nuts on the top of the struts but it worked anyway.
0. Unbolt propshaft from IRD and tie up.
1. Disconect battery and unbolt the battery tray.
2. Remove engine cover and air duct feed to the EGR.
3. Remove starter motor (I just took the bolts out and left it sitting.)
4. Jack the front of the car up as high as you can and get it on axle stands
5. Take the wheels off.
6. Take the undertray and side panels off.
7. Drain the coolant.
8. Drain the gearbox oil. Not sure if it must be done but I was intending to change the oil anyway.
9. Unbolt the wishbones front and rear supports and leave them still attached to the ball joints but supported on a bungie.
10. Unbolt the lower end of both drop links.
11. Remove the two remaining bolts holding the subframe and it should drop down. (Note I had sprayed around the mounts with paint earlier so that I could see where they should go when refitting).
12. Using a pry bar pop the drive shafts out. The struts should swing out enough to let you get them out of the way but you might need to turn the steering to get the upper ball joints in the right position or they can hold them back. Support them with a bungie and pull an old rubber glove or similar over the ends to protect them from dirt. I also jammed clean rags into the drive shaft sockets.
13. Release the two coolant hoses on the IRD and catch what water is still in the system. (note this might be easier done after lowering the engine but this was when I did it)
14. Pull the breather pipe out of the top of the IRD.
15. Remove the bolts holding the lower engine tie bar and remove the tie bar.
16. Remove the lower tie bar brackets and RHS IRD bolts.
17. Remove the four bolts holding the IRD to the gearbox (the top two are very awkward and will need a swivel on a long extension bar) and wrestle it off the splines, it’s very heavy, be careful. (Note this is the order Rave says but it might be easier to lower the engine first)
Now would be a good time to drain the IRD oil if it hasn’t been done in a long time.
18. Disconnect the clutch hydrolic line at the connection just above the gearbox. It has a plastic sleeve which slides in to release the connection and out to secure it (a bit like fuel line connections). I used very long nose pointy pliers to squeeze the sleeve in and release it.
19. Disconnect the first and reverse gear electrical sensor connections.
20. Pop the gear linkage ball joints at the gearbox end. I used a claw hammer for this which worked well, I didn’t take the linkage off even though Rave says you should. It made removing the gearbox a bit more awkward but still do-able. As I had removed the subframe and dropped the engine a bit I had just enough room.
20a. Unhook the front two exhaust support rubbers. (Rave says to unbolt it from the manifold but I didn't need to)
21. Find some way to support the engine as the next step is to unbolt the N/S engine/gearbox mount. I used an engine hoist and lowered the sump onto a piece of wood that was on a milk crate.
I had the inlet manifold off too but this shouldn't be necessary, I was doing other stuff at the same time.
22. Remove the N/S engine mount and allow the engine/gearbox to sag down onto a support (approx 2-3 inches).
23. Remove the support bracket from the gearbox.
24. Attach a hoist to the gearbox. (I used an eye on the top of the gearbox)
25. Remove the bolts holding the gearbox to the engine.
26. Remove the small bolt that was behind the IRD (10mm) holding the thin metal plate to the gearbox. I hadn’t done this and the plate caught on a dowel causeing a bit of grief until I realised what was happening..
27. Lever the gearbox off the engine and wriggle it out of the gap. The gear linkage will catch on the chassis leg but if the engine has been lowered enough it should come out with a bit of twisting and pulling. I used an engine hoist to support it and lower it down, If you don’t have one then you’ll need help.
28. Replace the slave cylinder and thrust bearing.
29. Remove the pressure plate and friction plate.
30. At this stage I cleaned the flywheel and scuffed it a bit with a wire wheel on a grinder. I didn’t replace the fly wheel, maybe I should have but it wasn’t showing any signs of failure and felt tight when I checked it. Time will tell if this was a stupid thing to do but I didn’t fancy paying out another £300 for a new flywheel. Some say the flywheel should last as long as two clutches, I hope they’re right.
31. Bolt on the new clutch parts making sure the friction plate is centred. I cobbled together a tool to do this using a roll of tape and a couple of sockets. Allan bolts should be 25Nm, don’t know if it was overkill but I used threadlock.
Once in and the bolts tightened a bit I double checked checked the friction plate was centred by measuring from the centreing tool I'd thrown together. (a 1/2" socket adapter with some tape wrapped round it
32. Refit everything in reverse order.
I used a trolley jack to lift the IRD into position before raising the engine and gearbox. I think it was easier to access the bolts with the engine lowered.
I should have refitted the IRD breather too but forgot and only remembered while typing this up. Doh!
33. Bleed the clutch.
At this point hopefully you have a good working clutch, unfortunately my master cylinder gave up while bleeding so I'm waiting for a new one.
Last edited:
phoebecp
Active Member
*UPDATE*
Well I'm part way through the removal of the bits needed to get to the clutch, worked on it most of the day on Saturday and yesterday evening, so far the IRD has been removed and next step is gearbox.
Oil drained from IRD and gearbox and ready to start...
Propshaft removed (going to get the VCU tested at some point anyway so took the whole lot off
Trying to get the subframe off was a right b*stard, the brackets holding the ARB to it we rock solid and wasn't enough room to get a breaker bar or windy gun on it, so removed the ARB along with it by disconnecting the drop links. I took the wishbones off as well because I wasnt sure of the condition and upon inspection I'm getting some new ones with all new bushes etc.
Disconnected all the gear linkages (wasn't as bad as was expecting) and got the IRD off last night, was a bit of a balancing act to get the shaft out of the gearbox and lowering it down (used a trolley jack and a couple of pairs of hands...) but alas it's out.
(excuse the coating of coolant)
Next thing to do is the gearbox itself, but finding time to do it at the moment is a struggle, then its clutch and re-assembly
Well I'm part way through the removal of the bits needed to get to the clutch, worked on it most of the day on Saturday and yesterday evening, so far the IRD has been removed and next step is gearbox.
Oil drained from IRD and gearbox and ready to start...
Trying to get the subframe off was a right b*stard, the brackets holding the ARB to it we rock solid and wasn't enough room to get a breaker bar or windy gun on it, so removed the ARB along with it by disconnecting the drop links. I took the wishbones off as well because I wasnt sure of the condition and upon inspection I'm getting some new ones with all new bushes etc.
Disconnected all the gear linkages (wasn't as bad as was expecting) and got the IRD off last night, was a bit of a balancing act to get the shaft out of the gearbox and lowering it down (used a trolley jack and a couple of pairs of hands...) but alas it's out.
(excuse the coating of coolant)
Next thing to do is the gearbox itself, but finding time to do it at the moment is a struggle, then its clutch and re-assembly
Alibro
Well-Known Member
I didn't bother taking the ARB off the subframe, just disconnected the drop links as you did and pulled the whole lot out. My wishbones were OK too so I left them bolted at the ball joints. I figured I'd end up ruining them if I tried to get them apart.
Good luck with the rest of the job.
Good luck with the rest of the job.
phoebecp
Active Member
At last the clutch and slave have been changed...drove it on Wednesday and it felt wonderful...here's some pictures of the last stages;
The engine mount that had to come off to free the gearbox-
The gear box off - we used a JCB with one chain over the engine lifting eye and a block and tackle with a strap around the gearbox so it could be lowered independently of the engine. Couldn't get the gear selector roll pin out to get that off so it was a tight squeeze to say the least....
New (right) vs Old (left) - the old one didn't look too bad really, a few burn marks but that may have been caused by the last journey I did in it when the slave was packing up, but just worth the change as it was all off anyway. New slave fitted to the gearbox, was definitely the cause of the problem, dot 4 everywhere...gave the gearbox a seam clean just to give it a tidy up and get rid of any of the fluid kicking about.
Refitting was fun, had to get the IRD onto the spline of the gearbox to be able to turn it slightly at the engine end to get them to line up and the gearbox to slide back on. Not a process I would want to repeat in a hurry, took 4 of us and a lot of brute force...
These are the brackets that hold the bushes on the ARB and the ARB to the subframe, gave them a sandblast off and re-painted
This was definaley a fun experience...trying to get the bushes out of the rear subframe mounts, without the use of a press and heating with a blowtorch not touching it, the solution was a touch of oxy acetylene, did the trick...
New bushes in, there was a bit of corrosion in the bracket so had to give it a bit of a wire brush and touch with a bit of sandpaper, pressed them in with a vice, no wonder the old ones were stubborn to get out, it wasn't exactly easy to get the new ones in !
New wishbones and ARB fitted along with a repainted subframe to tidy everything up
Steam cleaned out the underneath and wheel arches and under sealed it to within an inch of its life (still have some in my hair...)
We bled the clutch to get rid of air in the system and fluid through the new pipes and bled the breaks as well.
Fitted a new battery tray and refitted battery and inlet manifold/acoustic cover etc.
And she lives!! this picture was taken after successfully moving 4ft...tried to keep in running but I was getting warning lights galore, turns out when putting the starter motor in I'd forgotten to plug in a lead from the alternator so nothing was charging, but once that was in she ran very well.
Have been driving to work for the past 2 days and not had any problems with the clutch system at all (feels better than when I first bought it).
However....the rear window no longer drops so cant get the boot open without lifting to roof off and the SRS light is still on...so have given it to a local land rover specialist and they're going to read the codes from it to get to the bottom of the warning light and give the boot a prod too.
Overall the whole clutch took about 4 whole days of doing it - just had no time to get it done all at once - so not too bad really considering we'd never done a clutch before on a car like this and a lot of it had obviously never been taken to pieces recently if ever, so quite proud of it. But not wanting to do it again in a hurry
The engine mount that had to come off to free the gearbox-
The gear box off - we used a JCB with one chain over the engine lifting eye and a block and tackle with a strap around the gearbox so it could be lowered independently of the engine. Couldn't get the gear selector roll pin out to get that off so it was a tight squeeze to say the least....
New (right) vs Old (left) - the old one didn't look too bad really, a few burn marks but that may have been caused by the last journey I did in it when the slave was packing up, but just worth the change as it was all off anyway. New slave fitted to the gearbox, was definitely the cause of the problem, dot 4 everywhere...gave the gearbox a seam clean just to give it a tidy up and get rid of any of the fluid kicking about.
Refitting was fun, had to get the IRD onto the spline of the gearbox to be able to turn it slightly at the engine end to get them to line up and the gearbox to slide back on. Not a process I would want to repeat in a hurry, took 4 of us and a lot of brute force...
These are the brackets that hold the bushes on the ARB and the ARB to the subframe, gave them a sandblast off and re-painted
This was definaley a fun experience...trying to get the bushes out of the rear subframe mounts, without the use of a press and heating with a blowtorch not touching it, the solution was a touch of oxy acetylene, did the trick...
New bushes in, there was a bit of corrosion in the bracket so had to give it a bit of a wire brush and touch with a bit of sandpaper, pressed them in with a vice, no wonder the old ones were stubborn to get out, it wasn't exactly easy to get the new ones in !
New wishbones and ARB fitted along with a repainted subframe to tidy everything up
Steam cleaned out the underneath and wheel arches and under sealed it to within an inch of its life (still have some in my hair...)
We bled the clutch to get rid of air in the system and fluid through the new pipes and bled the breaks as well.
Fitted a new battery tray and refitted battery and inlet manifold/acoustic cover etc.
And she lives!! this picture was taken after successfully moving 4ft...tried to keep in running but I was getting warning lights galore, turns out when putting the starter motor in I'd forgotten to plug in a lead from the alternator so nothing was charging, but once that was in she ran very well.
Have been driving to work for the past 2 days and not had any problems with the clutch system at all (feels better than when I first bought it).
However....the rear window no longer drops so cant get the boot open without lifting to roof off and the SRS light is still on...so have given it to a local land rover specialist and they're going to read the codes from it to get to the bottom of the warning light and give the boot a prod too.
Overall the whole clutch took about 4 whole days of doing it - just had no time to get it done all at once - so not too bad really considering we'd never done a clutch before on a car like this and a lot of it had obviously never been taken to pieces recently if ever, so quite proud of it. But not wanting to do it again in a hurry
Thanks for the write up and photos. - I'm not sure if it puts me off or makes me feel more confident about undertaking the challenge, when the time comes...
Excellent to hear it all seems to have gone ok. Looks like it was a mammoth job!
Hope you get the SRS light and boot access sorted.
Jim
Excellent to hear it all seems to have gone ok. Looks like it was a mammoth job!
Hope you get the SRS light and boot access sorted.
Jim
Alibro
Well-Known Member
Well done getting the clutch fitted, I had the same problem with the roll pin and did the same as you but it was kinda tight.
For refitting the IRD, did you take the drive shafts out of the hubs, If not couldn't you have pushed the N/S shaft in and turned it?
For the wishbone bushes you could make one of these.
https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/build-your-own-shop-press.316311/
For refitting the IRD, did you take the drive shafts out of the hubs, If not couldn't you have pushed the N/S shaft in and turned it?
For the wishbone bushes you could make one of these.
https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/build-your-own-shop-press.316311/
phoebecp
Active Member
Not something to be taken lightly, but do-able if you've got access to some sort of lifting equipment and a breaker bar - a windy gun helps too
Mysteriously the srs light has now gone out...so not complaining too much there at the moment, had to get a new regulator and motor for the rear window as they're kaput
we'd tried turning the wheel but it didn't seem to be turning (or we didn't notice it was anyway, so not sure... looks a wonderful contraptionWell done getting the clutch fitted, I had the same problem with the roll pin and did the same as you but it was kinda tight.
For refitting the IRD, did you take the drive shafts out of the hubs, If not couldn't you have pushed the N/S shaft in and turned it?
For the wishbone bushes you could make one of these.
https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/build-your-own-shop-press.316311/
I have access to a press at work but we were at the stage of it was the only thing holding us up on a Saturday, so just wanted them out, otherwise would've had to wait till Monday to press them out - anyway, who doesn't like playing with a bit of oxy...
Alibro
Well-Known Member
Last time I replaced the rear suspension bushes I used a stick welder to heat up the center shaft until it was hot enough to melt it's way out. Then there was enough flex in the rubber to let me hammer a screwdriver in between the outer sleeve and the casing and prize it out.
