Ok, this is not related to this thread, are our ramblings ever?.
But on the subject of oils and branded vs supermarket, have a look at this. I was quite surprised. Not that any of us would ever use oils in this situation.
Mike

Lol, Hiya Mike, a totally unimpressive test - at - 40 !!!!
they are joking - and it means nothing at all.
Lubricants are not tested via pouring out of a bottle - they are tested via a pressurised system.
That video is a load of bollox really., In fact - THE worst ever oil to hit the market was mobil one ! - it caused more engine catastrophic failures than any other engine oil.
It - in the early days - caused mix issues with conventional oils.
Loads of you tube cr&p shows silly comparisons like this.
Stick to Cheap supermarket oil - and I guarantee you will never - ever notice any difference - the only caveat is stick with a known name - avoid totally unknown names - - without research- - - supermarket 'brands' are usually absolutely - superb. - paying for so called 'synthetic' (cough cough Bull$hit) or semi synthetic (Semi Bull$hit) is purely a waste of dosh - you have been warned (CONNED) do not fall for the BS ! let the force be with you .................

Joe_H said:

Lol, Hiya Mike, a totally unimpressive test - at - 40 !!!!
they are joking - and it means nothing at all.
Lubricants are not tested via pouring out of a bottle - they are tested via a pressurised system.
That video is a load of bollox really., In fact - THE worst ever oil to hit the market was mobil one ! - it caused more engine catastrophic failures than any other engine oil.
It - in the early days - caused mix issues with conventional oils.
Loads of you tube cr&p shows silly comparisons like this.
Stick to Cheap supermarket oil - and I guarantee you will never - ever notice any difference - the only caveat is stick with a known name - avoid totally unknown names - - without research- - - supermarket 'brands' are usually absolutely - superb. - paying for so called 'synthetic' (cough cough Bull$hit) or semi synthetic (Semi Bull$hit) is purely a waste of dosh - you have been warned (CONNED) do not fall for the BS ! let the force be with you .................

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How many beers you had today your ramblings get better with every post.
Got to admit, I never go for the big brands.
I'm a big Carlube fan. Nice and cheap, but good and used by loads of us cheapskates.
Mike

Skinny Mike said:

How many beers you had today your ramblings get better with every post.
Got to admit, I never go for the big brands.
I'm a big Carlube fan. Nice and cheap, but good and used by loads of us cheapskates.
Mike

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I like Carlube oils too. Conveniently they make an MTF94 manual box oil in addition to the excellent ATF-U auto box fluid

Joe_H said:

Hi mate, There is a direct correlation between 10W40 and 75W80, it is all in the numbering system - very confusing ! - the rating system is definitely not the same ! - one cannot compare them side by side.

See wiki here -
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gear_oil

Also note -
"API viscosity ratings for gear oils are not directly comparable with those for motor oil, and they are thinner than the figures suggest. For example, many modern gearboxes use a 75W90 gear oil, which is actually of equivalent viscosity to a 10W40 motor oil. Multigrade gear oils are becoming more common; while gear oil does not reach the temperatures of motor oil, it does warm up appreciably as the car is driven, due mostly to shearfriction (with a small amount of heat conduction through the bellhousing from the engine block)."

The minor differences are some of the EP (extreme pressure) additives) - however - due to no differential on the PG1 box (it is in the IRD) it is no issue.. so yes - 10W40 Automotive is fine. - IF however - it had a built in DIFF - it may be more of a concern - not to be bit to others

Fear not little drooping seat (to quote the Goon Shows) - sheesh - my age is coming out now - - 'tales of old Dartmoor' etc///

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Hope you meant Getrag . We're talking about my TD4, not my K Series.
In any case I was out before I saw the reply and bought an EU gallon of ATF (5L cause it was cheaper than 3L) and 3L of Carlube MTF94 so I'm assuming it will be fine once the ATF has done it's stuff.

Alibro said:

Hope you meant Getrag . We're talking about my TD4, not my K Series.
In any case I was out before I saw the reply and bought an EU gallon of ATF (5L cause it was cheaper than 3L) and 3L of Carlube MTF94 so I'm assuming it will be fine once the ATF has done it's stuff.

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LR specified MTF94 for PG1 and Getrag box and most other LR boxes too. I suspect this was to avoid confusion in the dealers workshop. MTF94 is a kind of one size fits all gearbox oil.

Thanks Nodge, You hear from some people it is critical to use the right oil or your gearbox will fall off then others say they use any old thing so it is hard to know what is correct. I heard it is important to use MTF94 because of some of the materials inside the gearbox box but don't know enough about it to be able to comment.

Back to the reason for this thread, I drained the gearbox oil earlier and was surprised at how thin and kinda grey it was but glad to see no metal bits. I even passed it through a sieve to be sure. Filled it with ATF and will take it for a 150ish mile spin when I get her Taxed and Insured. Will report back with the results.

Alibro said:

Thanks Nodge, You hear from some people it is critical to use the right oil or your gearbox will fall off then others say they use any old thing so it is hard to know what is correct. I heard it is important to use MTF94 because of some of the materials inside the gearbox box but don't know enough about it to be able to comment.

Back to the reason for this thread, I drained the gearbox oil earlier and was surprised at how thin and kinda grey it was but glad to see no metal bits. I even passed it through a sieve to be sure. Filled it with ATF and will take it for a 150ish mile spin when I get her Taxed and Insured. Will report back with the results.

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a gear box contains bearings and gears those will run fine with hydraulic oil,engine oil, atf or thick gear oil, and lrs have series started on gear oil ,later lt95s in first range rovers used engine oil ,later 77s used atf as did r380s, what does mind what oil is used is the baulk rings, a baulk ring designed for mtf or atf wont do well with gear oil especially ep 90 ,thinner oils are used as they cool and produce less heat and drag, if a box will run on mtf atf will be ok too, r380s used atf then later mtf ,some find mtf gives better gear selection others not, what does wear gear boxes is running on the same oil too long ,bearings suffer before the gears do

Alibro said:

Thanks Nodge, You hear from some people it is critical to use the right oil or your gearbox will fall off then others say they use any old thing so it is hard to know what is correct. I heard it is important to use MTF94 because of some of the materials inside the gearbox box but don't know enough about it to be able to comment.

Back to the reason for this thread, I drained the gearbox oil earlier and was surprised at how thin and kinda grey it was but glad to see no metal bits. I even passed it through a sieve to be sure. Filled it with ATF and will take it for a 150ish mile spin when I get her Taxed and Insured. Will report back with the results.

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Hi Alibro, I hope it sorts it, I really do, but be prepared for the worst case - that is is a fooked synchro cone - hopefully not,
Finger crossed for you mate...
Great to see no metal bits or traces of 'gold' - that is a good sign and a good start. !!!!!

Now I will try to help...............
I will get me door mat - face the local (nearest and cheap) bar - and offer a few words of hope for you in a 'spirit'ual' manner...................................
In the word of the prophet 'Joao' the barman -
Go in peace my son - and hopefully not in pieces..

LOL, I really appreciate the help (most of it ) and am prepared for the worst.
Positives are, I got the car for a good price, It seems to be great apart from the gearbox issue, It is a project car at the minute so no pressure. I replaced the clutch in my K series recently so I'm hoping a lot of the work would be similar.

Wee update, The car was only taxed and insured today so took it out for the first time since filling the gearbox with ATF and it seems to have made a big difference. I think it may have crunched once into third gear but the rest of the 50 or so miles it was nice and smooth. Planning to do a few more miles tomorrow with the ATF before putting in the MTF94 but at the minute poor Joe_H is in serious danger of being on the receiving end of a great big slobbery kiss!!!!!

Alibro said:

Wee update, The car was only taxed and insured today so took it out for the first time since filling the gearbox with ATF and it seems to have made a big difference. I think it may have crunched once into third gear but the rest of the 50 or so miles it was nice and smooth. Planning to do a few more miles tomorrow with the ATF before putting in the MTF94 but at the minute poor Joe_H is in serious danger of being on the receiving end of a great big slobbery kiss!!!!!

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lol I would keep it in for around 200 town miles with lots of changes really - so hang on a bit... no harm at all will arise.
Also, if it is fine on atf - it may well be ok then on the main oil - but the proof of the pudding etc........ fingers crossed - (but sounds really good so far )
And IF it ends up ok ... no tongues

Might have to doo that to my Gbox, its a tad notchy, but I was thinking the clutch is an issue.

A little story on the slick50. I used to help a mechanic out, where
i learnt most of what I know. He said all additives were a con until a customer insisted he put slick50 in the engine. Car had a full service, set up on the rolling road and then had the slick50 added. The engine speed at tick over rose A couple of hundred rpm during the time you are suposed to leave it running when you it in. They had to reset the car up. He was convinced it had made a difference.
I decided to put it in my Mums 525 BMW, it was T reg, I am going back to 1983-4, the tick over speed rose by 150 rpm and I had to adjust it being an auto. Several months later I came home one friday evening and step father asks me to change the oil on the bemer, so I dropped the oil and undid the oil filter housing and he had bought the wrong filter. Being 7 pm I was left with no choice but to wait till the morning to go get the correct one.
I get up sat morning at about 9;30 and go down stairs, asks step dad where my Mum is and he replies she has gone to asda. I look through the window and the beemer has gone. Not a drip of oil in her, no filter, and no sump plug in.
5 minute later up pulls the beemer, I run out and ask my mum if she had noticed a red light on the dash. she just said"I wondered what that was for".
Now Asda was 3-4 miles away, and the car went there and back. I went and got a filter, filled her up with oil and started her. Sweet as ever, The beemer had 80,000 miles on the clock and was sold with over 150,000 a few years later.
I was then and still am convinced it was the slick50 that saved that engine on that day.

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Joe_H said:

lol I would keep it in for around 200 town miles with lots of changes really - so hang on a bit... no harm at all will arise.
Also, if it is fine on atf - it may well be ok then on the main oil - but the proof of the pudding etc........ fingers crossed - (but sounds really good so far )
And IF it ends up ok ... no tongues

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Spoilsport!

Lowbank said:

Might have to doo that to my Gbox, its a tad notchy, but I was thinking the clutch is an issue.

A little story on the slick50. I used to help a mechanic out, where
i learnt most of what I know. He said all additives were a con until a customer insisted he put slick50 in the engine. Car had a full service, set up on the rolling road and then had the slick50 added. The engine speed at tick over rose A couple of hundred rpm during the time you are suposed to leave it running when you it in. They had to reset the car up. He was convinced it had made a difference.
I decided to put it in my Mums 525 BMW, it was T reg, I am going back to 1983-4, the tick over speed rose by 150 rpm and I had to adjust it being an auto. Several months later I came home one friday evening and step father asks me to change the oil on the bemer, so I dropped the oil and undid the oil filter housing and he had bought the wrong filter. Being 7 pm I was left with no choice but to wait till the morning to go get the correct one.
I get up sat morning at about 9;30 and go down stairs, asks step dad where my Mum is and he replies she has gone to asda. I look through the window and the beemer has gone. Not a drip of oil in her, no filter, and no sump plug in.
5 minute later up pulls the beemer, I run out and ask my mum if she had noticed a red light on the dash. she just said"I wondered what that was for".
Now Asda was 3-4 miles away, and the car went there and back. I went and got a filter, filled her up with oil and started her. Sweet as ever, The beemer had 80,000 miles on the clock and was sold with over 150,000 a few years later.
I was then and still am convinced it was the slick50 that saved that engine on that day.

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About 15 years ago my bride did a similar thing in her old Clio. She had an oil and filter change at Kwik Fit in Nelson, went to Burnley shopping, came home and 'casually' told me there was a red light on.
Checked for oil - NONE - also - NO FILTER !!!!!.... new filter and new oil and car was - to my huge surprise - absolutely fine. We later found the 'Kwik Fit' filter at the road side and a long oil click near the Asda turn off towards Colne (about 1/4 mile from Kwik Fit !) (You know the area I am sure) also, the whole drivers side of the car underneath was splattered - I reckon that from dumping the oil she also covered about.- what - say - 6 miles ? - Kwik fit - surprisingly ! - said they would be liable for damages (probably ONLY because they knew the car was not worth much!) - oil pressure check showed fine - compression check was fine - Had Holden and Hartley take a look at the crank bearings - a main cap and a big end - looked fine as did the shells. (They also paid for that.)
As everything looked ok, and the car was not worth that much - they settled for the costs incurred and a new set of tyres. - we used the car for the next few years travelling up and down to Hamble (Southampton) from Nelson (to sort our boat out) - no worries at all - and no slick 50 ever !

Yes, I am 100% sure we were 100% lucky - I was utterly amazed. But, hey.. some you win etc. - I have also heard many reports as well of similar instances where cars have lost sump plugs etc and driven to the next turn off from a motorway before calling AA (From an AA guy mate) - (with no 'apparent' damage after towing and replacing plug and oil etc). I am also sure that for every instance of an 'apparent' no long term damage' incident - there are hundreds that suffer major failure.

Another really common and documented occurrence of 'similar' issues is in the marine engine business !! - this time with sea water getting into engines when stopped. (usually via the exhaust due to blockage of the anti siphon valve.) If the engine doesn't hydraulic lock on starting then often the engine starts with the crank case half full of seawater !!. often the engines in question will be run for many HOURS in this state and have been perfectly 'revived' with multiple oil flushings. I have seen marine diesels dump virtually all their oil out of the breather and into the bilges due to this and be left with more seawater than oil in the sump - and still be ok after many many hours running. The biggest problems are / were engines with magnesium alloy parts (such as the Mercedes OM636) - it uses Mag alloy as part of cam bearings and rear bearing housings - this reacts with the salt water and eventually causes a major failure no matter what you do - sometimes quite a while after ! - but the failure is only due to the Mag parts and WILL happen.
Seawater in marine engine sumps (often a huge amount - several litres !) with no long term effects after many many hours is a very common occurrence - often it can go unchecked for a long time until one day the engine wont start due to a hydraulic lock! - ask any marine engine specialist. As the oil will sit on top of the water the engine will start on almost pure salt water for lube ! - then it will form a nasty semi emulsified mix - eventually settling into it's component parts again ready fro the next start... yikes ! - The older diesels are definitely far less prone to any long term issues.

Basically - (IMHO) If slick 50 were any good - or any of these additives in reality - then motor oil producers would be using them in their oils.

Alibro said:

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Spoilsport!

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And no groping !

Joe_H said:

And no groping !

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Not really much point then.

Alibro said:

Not really much point then.

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Hmmmm... ... now, IF I had an Audi TT ....... or a Suzuki or Rav.. or, maybe if I was good at Perm and blue rinse. ????... Hmmmmm..... then I might have settled for a BJ

But........ Alas ... I much prefer A'lass

Perhaps its was just luck.
I have stripped engines that did less miles that were completly scrap.

Lowbank said:

Perhaps its was just luck.
I have stripped engines that did less miles that were completly scrap.

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Agreed mate, yes, it doesn't take much to cause major damage in a fairly short time. How many engines have we seen with very low miles that are caked with crud in the crankcase and oil galleries - sometimes even with blocked crank journal feeds - that are totally scrapped due in a lot of cases to lack of servicing such as a lazy owner or back street bodger - like the old back street garage trick of cleaning the oil filter outside with paraffin to save a quid or two ....
Blocked crank breathers and cruddy aftermarket cheapo chrome and brillo pad air filters that were once the rage and guaranteed to cause scored bores and valve seat issues.. engines revved until the valves 'bounce' by kids with backward baseball caps - or was that backward kids with baseball caps ?? I forget..
Or, just a 'Friday' British car engine.... .. the POETS day special... (Pi$$ off early - tomorrows Saturday)