Saint.V8 said:
Opps :eek: ....OK revise to say....

The output from the Crank sensor sensor is also used, in conjunction with the start of injection sensor, to determine and control ignition timing.

The ECM uses the input signals from the start of injection sensor, together with signals from the crankshaft position sensor, to detect the actual start of injection angle. The detected actual value is adjusted by the ECM to a nominal value via the injection timing solenoid.

As it does in RAVE....:eek:

(but what is said is wrongerer than mine!!):D:p:D
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Have never tried it so can't say, but it would seem to be possible. The engine does need a speed signal to even tick over but it would get that from number four injector. So what he says does seem plausible. :):)
 
Right quick update, the tank is off and has been cleaned out, pump is being cleaned and pipes etc, can you clean the injectors? if so which is the best way to do it
 
wammers said:
Have never tried it so can't say, but it would seem to be possible. The engine does need a speed signal to even tick over but it would get that from number four injector. So what he says does seem plausible. :):)
Click to expand...
But, if the ECM isn't getting a Crank Signal it won't disengage the Stop Solenoid surely....!!

I understand that if the ECM is getting a pulse from No 4 sensor then it must be injecting, but if the Stop Solenoid is closed, the FIP hasn't got any diesel to put into Inector No4 and as such the needle wont lift and hence no signal to the ECM that the engine is running....

OR

Does the starter turning, disengage the Stop Solenoid??

EDIT: Just read RAVE SS is controlled on Ignition ON signal - not from CKP sensor :eek:

So I guess in theroy it is possible - but it will be the first I have heard of it, as loss of crank usually prohibits starting!!

As attached.....
 

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Sorry to have upset so many people. If there is a conflict with the crank and injector signal, the engine doesn't know what to do. Disconnecting the crank sensor means it just takes it's signal from no.4 injector. If the the injector pump is delivering fuel, it will run, I have done it. The mismatch in timing can be caused by among other things a stretched chain. It will only run in limp mode, if it doesn't run then, suspect the injection pump.
 
robinhoodlandrover said:
Sorry to have upset so many people. If there is a conflict with the crank and injector signal, the engine doesn't know what to do. Disconnecting the crank sensor means it just takes it's signal from no.4 injector. If the the injector pump is delivering fuel, it will run, I have done it. The mismatch in timing can be caused by among other things a stretched chain. It will only run in limp mode, if it doesn't run then, suspect the injection pump.
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No upset just the usualy LandyZone debate is all....

After reading RAVE, it the engine is already running, disconnection or loss of CKP signal would cause a limp home mode as you say....

I just have doubts on if it will start without a CKP signal or not....as Wammers said above, never tried it so wouldn't know...maybe it is something a kind (and brave) oil burner owner could try and see if it will start with the CKP disconnected....!!! Intrigued to know....

Thick skin sometimes needed on LZ....:D
 
Right after that debate, another quick update, all the fuel system has been cleaned and tried to start again and she keeps nearly firing into life but after 5 minutes or more the battery started to falter then tried easy start (a bit late i know) and it made loud knocking noise, i am at my wits end now, don't know why it wont go, i have not got a compression tester could just do with someone to give me an hour of there experience to point me in the right direction, i will pay of course, this is driving me mad.....................
 
phattdude said:
Right after that debate, another quick update, all the fuel system has been cleaned and tried to start again and she keeps nearly firing into life but after 5 minutes or more the battery started to falter then tried easy start (a bit late i know) and it made loud knocking noise, i am at my wits end now, don't know why it wont go, i have not got a compression tester could just do with someone to give me an hour of there experience to point me in the right direction, i will pay of course, this is driving me mad.....................
Click to expand...

also forgot to say, the under bonnet fuse box smells, i have checked the fuses etc and no signs of burning
 
phattdude said:
also forgot to say, the under bonnet fuse box smells, i have checked the fuses etc and no signs of burning
Click to expand...

Probably from all that cranking if you have the injector pipes off the fip turning over with a rag to Catch diesel squirting out you might have a better quicker chance of cleaning the fip out with all that black crap
 
phattdude said:
where is the crank sensor, and is it worth disconnecting and trying again
Click to expand...

Leavin for now you just said it was trying to fire , it must just be the fip I would take all injector pipes off ensure what is comming out it clean , clean all injector pipe with a any decent cleaning agent blow out with air and try again remember don't put air manifold on until its running dont want to waste your time putting and taking that off, but as datatek say while the manifold is off all glow plugs out and do a compression test or at lest put your finger over each hole and check there is some Compression
 
One more Thought you Cleaned tank in tank and filter what about the fuel line that leads from pump to filter I would ensure that is squirting out clean fuel before connecting to the fip and if you did take the crank sensor off surly the intank pump will stop so it might only run with the fuel left in the fip , and don't forget if you suspect intank pump gravity feed the fip good luck mate
 
defender300td1 said:
One more Thought you Cleaned tank in tank and filter what about the fuel line that leads from pump to filter I would ensure that is squirting out clean fuel before connecting to the fip and if you did take the crank sensor off surly the intank pump will stop so it might only run with the fuel left in the fip , and don't forget if you suspect intank pump gravity feed the fip good luck mate
Click to expand...


many thanks, that will be my next job in the morning, i did not clean the pipes but i did run fuel through them up to the filter housing until they ran clean and also after the filter was on the pipe to the fip only thing left is fip and the injectors.................

on another note, spoke to the guy i bought it off and he said that it was running fine until he parked it up and the battery went flat then all the problems have come from there, it seems so strange that it wont run from a flat battery
 
phattdude said:
many thanks, that will be my next job in the morning, i did not clean the pipes but i did run fuel through them up to the filter housing until they ran clean and also after the filter was on the pipe to the fip only thing left is fip and the injectors.................

on another note, spoke to the guy i bought it off and he said that it was running fine until he parked it up and the battery went flat then all the problems have come from there, it seems so strange that it wont run from a flat battery
Click to expand...

Not being funny he would tell you that !
 
phattdude said:
many thanks, that will be my next job in the morning, i did not clean the pipes but i did run fuel through them up to the filter housing until they ran clean and also after the filter was on the pipe to the fip only thing left is fip and the injectors.................

on another note, spoke to the guy i bought it off and he said that it was running fine until he parked it up and the battery went flat then all the problems have come from there, it seems so strange that it wont run from a flat battery
Click to expand...
When they are stood is when you get bacterial growth in the fuel so not so strange that it won't start.
 
dont mean to repeat myself im no expert but you are having same problems ive had
tries to fire but wont run even on easy start
i cleaned tank, fuel lines, changed stop solenoid, cleaned injectors.
a mechanic friend eventually came to have look and it was a blocked catalyst, i use bio-diesel(made properly not straight from supermarket to the tank) and unburnt oil eventually blocked it up, with that **** that has come out of your fuel tank that looks like engine oil i would suspect the same.
ive owned mine for 12 months but dont know if it has been run on bio before and its the original cat, but if its going to cost £100 to buy and its a pain in the arse to change it far out weighs using derv. just loosen the clamp off the turbo and give it a try.
give it a go it may work or not
regards Tim
 
the hammer said:
dont mean to repeat myself im no expert but you are having same problems ive had
tries to fire but wont run even on easy start
i cleaned tank, fuel lines, changed stop solenoid, cleaned injectors.
a mechanic friend eventually came to have look and it was a blocked catalyst, i use bio-diesel(made properly not straight from supermarket to the tank) and unburnt oil eventually blocked it up, with that **** that has come out of your fuel tank that looks like engine oil i would suspect the same.
ive owned mine for 12 months but dont know if it has been run on bio before and its the original cat, but if its going to cost £100 to buy and its a pain in the arse to change it far out weighs using derv. just loosen the clamp off the turbo and give it a try.
give it a go it may work or not
regards Tim
Click to expand...


Hi Tim it has crossed my mind as i am a bio user myself, so i have seperated the pipe at the turbo and it smoked like a pig
IMAG0672_zpsd774f963.jpg


so i took the inlet manifold off and this is what i saw
IMAG0671_zps186448c3.jpg

any ideas, i think it has been run on black diesel
 
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