Hi all, got a general opinion question for everyone, I currently have a late 2007 FL2 Xs and have seen advertised locally a 2013 FL2 I really like the look of, also an XS, i know all the failure points of the pre facelift FL2 but I’m lead to believe most of these got resolved when they brought out the facelift model, so is there an advantage to having a facelift model over pre facelift except for the obvious, like DAB radio etc, is there something mechanically more sound about the pre facelift that stands above the facelift or is the facelift model just totally a better car, I don’t want to jump from the frying pan in to the fire, to me it seems everything I’ve had to sort on my 2007 model was already ironed out on the facelift like swirl flaps, I know the facelift model has a DPF which mine doesn’t but what’s the general consensus, also my current car is Auto and the 2013 I’m interested in is manual, thanks guys...

DAB isn't a reason to change the car, as it can be added pretty cheaply.

If you've sorted out all the issues with yours, and you're happy with what you have, then I personally can't see the point in changing, especially if it's the same model, which will be similarly specified.

The later diff had a stronger bearing, but they still fail. The 4th gen Haldex is an improvement, but unless it's been maintained properly, there's no guarantee it'll be reliable.

If you only do short journeys, a DPF isn't going to be happy, and you're better off without it.

Did I mention mine is Narvik Black and the one I’m looking at is White, I’ve got to say it, I’m so sick f cleaning it, it takes so much effort, my white transit connect van takes a quarter of the time to clean, the only thing I am worried about apart from having a DPF is the electronic hand brake, I hear these can cause issue and are costly to repair, I think I just want something different but not that different and my wife will be glad of a manual, she just can’t get on with the Auto box

I avoid a black car at all costs, preferring red, blue, grey or even white, but anything that looks ok dirty is ok with me.

The later FL2 is an improvement according to some. I'm not convinced myself, as I already think the FL2 is electronically too complicated, and the later model with the DPF and more advanced electronics, is the next step forward. This means potentially more trips to the dealer, if you can't do the electronic stuff yourself.

The DPF needs cleaning occasionally, which it will do automatically, if the drive cycle is accommodating, or it requires a suitable diagnostic tool, or a trip to the dealer if there's some reason why it hasn't regenerated itself.

The EPB simply needs to be put into service mode to retract the pistons for pad changes. Once the brake pad/rotors are replaced, you simply take it back out of service mode. I think it's actually easier with the EPB, as there's no messing with stuck or rusted HB shoes inside the bell of the rotor.

Nodge68 said:

I avoid a black car at all costs, preferring red, blue, grey or even white, but anything that looks ok dirty is ok with me.

The later FL2 is an improvement according to some. I'm not convinced myself, as I already think the FL2 is electronically too complicated, and the later model with the DPF and more advanced electronics, is the next step forward. This means potentially more trips to the dealer, if you can't do the electronic stuff yourself.

The DPF needs cleaning occasionally, which it will do automatically, if the drive cycle is accommodating, or it requires a suitable diagnostic tool, or a trip to the dealer if there's some reason why it hasn't regenerated itself.

The EPB simply needs to be put into service mode to retract the pistons for pad changes. Once the brake pad/rotors are replaced, you simply take it back out of service mode. I think it's actually easier with the EPB, as there's no messing with stuck or rusted HB shoes inside the bell of the rotor.

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Thanks for that, as we know from one of my previous posts about programming in a six CD disc changing I definitely can’t do the electronics my self and evidently have had a problem finding people who can, not sure it’s totally going to put me off though, what’s your opinion of manual over Auto in the FL2, surely the manual option is potentially less problematic, do you know the sort of age the clutches fail on the manual FL2s, the vehicle I’m looking at is on 99k... yes I am at a point now of I’ve lived with black paintwork for 3 years and it’s time for a change, it looks amazing for that 10 minutes after you’ve cleaned and waxed it but then the dust starts to statically be drawn to it...

So a 2012 will just be coming up for it’s 10 year service. Presumably your present one has had that done?

sharmanator43 said:

Thanks for that, as we know from one of my previous posts about programming in a six CD disc changing I definitely can’t do the electronics my self and evidently have had a problem finding people who can

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It's a shame you're not local, as I can do that upgrade.

sharmanator43 said:

what’s your opinion of manual over Auto in the FL2, surely the manual option is potentially less problematic, do you know the sort of age the clutches fail on the manual FL2s, the vehicle I’m looking at is on 99k..

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From a driving point of view, I prefer an auto. From a financial point of view, the manual makes more sense.
It'll be less problematic than an auto, and be able 25% better on fuel too.

A clutch should last 100k miles, but could be less or could be more, depending entirely on driver and use.

sharmanator43 said:

I’ve lived with black paintwork for 3 years and it’s time for a change, it looks amazing for that 10 minutes after you’ve cleaned and waxed it but then the dust starts to statically be drawn to it...

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I'd not last 3 weeks with black, as it a nightmare to keep clean.

Stv123 said:

So a 2012 will just be coming up for it’s 10 year service. Presumably your present one has had that done?

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Yeah actually I hadn’t thought of that, the one I’ve currently got is late 2007, I bought it early 2018 so I got lumbered for the 10 year service in that too, I’ll definitely check the service history but my guessing is they wouldn’t have done it 2 years early so I’ll get landed again

sharmanator43 said:

Yeah actually I hadn’t thought of that, the one I’ve currently got is late 2007, I bought it early 2018 so I got lumbered for the 10 year service in that too, I’ll definitely check the service history but my guessing is they wouldn’t have done it 2 years early so I’ll get landed again

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The timing belt replacement was reduced to 7 years after the facelift, so it should be done already.

Nodge68 said:

It's a shame you're not local, as I can do that upgrade.

From a driving point of view, I prefer an auto. From a financial point of view, the manual makes more sense.
It'll be less problematic than an auto, and be able 25% better on fuel too.

A clutch should last 100k miles, but could be less or could be more, depending entirely on driver and use.

I'd not last 3 weeks with black, as it a nightmare to keep clean.

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Sorry for late reply, we’ve been working away this week, I’m so undecided on the manual FL2, I’m still going over to test drive tomorrow but even if I love it I’m still going to go away and think about it, I’ve always had that feeling of 100k is a turning point in a cars life, it’s the point of this is either a good one or now is the time it’s going to start costing me, my 2007 FL2 is still only on 79k and like I told you before it’s had all the major stuff done, I even had the transfer box removed, checked, completely drained of oil and flushed then refitted with new oil so I have really looked after it, I guess I’ll go on gut feeling when I’m there, and yes definitely living closer to you would have many advantages

Nodge68 said:

The timing belt replacement was reduced to 7 years after the facelift, so it should be done already.

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Oh yeah the dealer I’m buying from has a very good reputation, he deals solely in Land Rover Range Rover and every used vehicle leaves the yard with full cam belt kit, Aircon service, engine service and MOT regardless of when they were last done so I should have no worries there

Nodge68 said:

It's a shame you're not local, as I can do that upgrade.

From a driving point of view, I prefer an auto. From a financial point of view, the manual makes more sense.
It'll be less problematic than an auto, and be able 25% better on fuel too.

A clutch should last 100k miles, but could be less or could be more, depending entirely on driver and use.

I'd not last 3 weeks with black, as it a nightmare to keep clean.

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Morning Nodge, I know this is an older post but I thought I’d update you, I wouldn’t normally do it but I decided to do a cheap online vehicle check on the 2013 manual FL2 I was looking at and it came back with unsettled finance, I then did an MOT check and considering it had only had an MOT a few weeks ago the advisories were rear tyres down to the legal limit, rear brake pads down to their limit, rear brake discs down to their limit, I can’t imagine the owner has replaced all these then immediately put it up for sale so I decided it wasnt worth the journey, this particular vehicle was at sale from a local dealer who does have a good reputation but it was basically a trade in he was selling on so it was a bit more of a sold as seen, you can imagine the bill, I know rule one of FL2 ownership is never just change 2 tyres so I’d be looking at 4 new tyres, rear discs and pads and as far as I’m aware it’s a specialist job at the back due to the nature of the electronic handbrake, so I’m sticking with my 07 Auto which brings me on to a question you might be able to answer, my Auto gear selector has broken, it still selects fine but the little plastic rod located under the gear selector knob has snapped so you can shift gear without pressing in the button, I’ve bought a good salvaged selector from the same model year and I’m going to fit it myself, I noticed it has a ribbon cable which I’m guessing is for the illumination of the gear position indicator on the centre console and another green pin socket which I’m guessing a loom plugs in to telling the car which gear is selected for display on the dash and activation of reverse lights etc, my question is do you think this salvaged item will need SDD again to program it to the car, I’ve got a fear I’ll get it all back together and the car won’t recognise it, also regards the 6 CD changer, I could arrange a little trip to Newquay next year if you fancy a bit of cash in hand programming, shame we can’t DM on here really, sorry for the long drawn out message, hope you don’t mind

The electronic rear brakes aren't difficult or expensive, and putting them into service mode is easy.
However it's wise not to buy a vehicle which has outstanding finance registered against it, as it could well be removed by the finance company later on.

I don't think the circuit connected to the ribbon cable needs configuring, so it should be a simple swap.

As for upgrading your HU, then yes it shouldn't be a problem, as I have an IID and JLR SDD, so CCF file editing can be done. Just let me know when you're coming, and we'll arrange something.

Nodge68 said:

The electronic rear brakes aren't difficult or expensive, and putting them into service mode is easy.
However it's wise not to buy a vehicle which has outstanding finance registered against it, as it could well be removed by the finance company later on.

I don't think the circuit connected to the ribbon cable needs configuring, so it should be a simple swap.

As for upgrading your HU, then yes it shouldn't be a problem, as I have an IID and JLR SDD, so CCF file editing can be done. Just let me know when you're coming, and we'll arrange something.

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That’s great news thanks for that, I must admit the original reason for looking for a later FL2 was the Auto gearbox, my wife is now going to start using the car and wasn’t keen on the Auto box but we’ve out again in it today and she’s now really comfortable with it, it’s still a lovely car and has been very well maintained so I think we’re happy to keep it, I’ll just have put up with the constant cleaning that black requires... I’m thinking maybe next spring for a little West Country getaway if that works for you at that time, thanks for that

Vehicles with finance on them... the finance company can take the vehicle if the loan is unpaid as the car is "guarantee" against the loan being unpaid. Unfortunately the online checks don't pick up "log book loans" which can catch you out.

DPF's and low miles... Not a problem. I constantly do 3.5 mile trips. They just fill up a bit quicker. If it gets to the stage it's full and it's upset by this yer get a reduced performance message and it will loose power. Disconnect battery, wait 10 seconds then reconnect battery. They take it for a drive... mine will empty from full in 9 minutes at 50mph continuous speed. There are occasions when dpf's fail, like everything can. There's options to have the car force clean the dpf itself, get the fault fixed like sensor problems resolved or take the dpf oft and clean it out yerself.

Facelift models... revised interior making it feel a higher premium vehicle. Option of the SD4 higher power output engine (auto box only) and a few style revisions on the outside. Updates on the dash and electronics in certain areas. The face lift came out to kick start sales growth again, update to improve and to help beat oft some of the competition.

MOT's... some peeps use the mot to see what needs repaired. They get a list of fails and get them resolved. They do this on purpose to get an independent opinion and maintain the vehicle to "whats needed" only. Good and bad sides to this. It can be worrying to see a list of faults but once fixed then they're resolved. There's a lot of people out there who only get things fixed when told/forced to. A list of mot fails and repairs is just as worrying as a fault free full service history. Garages will bill fault repair and diagnostics separate to service work if you ask them to. Even if the work is done at the same time. So all history is good to a certain extent but yer need to consider how the history has been created. Sellers tend to push maintenance work like clutch invoice changes as it benefits the sale. They will hide invoices for repeating faults.