H

Hiddenpower

New Member
Hi there guys. I'm new to Landrovers but been working on my own cars on and off for a few years now.

I just recently got my new toy a 90 with a 200 TDi conversion. She appears to have been offroaded rather hard but mostly she runs fine and everything is on the button (bar a couple of lamps and things that need sorting and a transmission brake that needs looking at) and I'm just in the process of trying to fix her up again.

I'm currently having an issue with what seems to be a sticky Starter motor. I have checked the relays and they're all intact and operating correctly. I have had it start intermittently and when it does it sounds just fine but often when the ignition switch is hit the starter tries to turn over but struggles to move. This is accompanied by a dimming of the cabin light if it's on which I assume is the motor drawing too much power because it's stuck. I'm just wondering if there's an easier way to get to it than removing the inlet and exhaust manifolds and possibly even the turbo too, if there is then I would be grateful for any advice. Any advice is welcome anyway.
 
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Right brief update. I have since removed the manifolds and gotten to the Starter. Having tested it off of the engine directly off the battery I'd say there's no problem with it. After giving everything a good clean and returning it to its rightful place the problem with starting is still intermittent. I'm guessing there's a wiring fault somewhere but it's beyond me how to search for it. The solenoid makes a clunk but not as loud as it should suggesting to me that maybe it doesn't get enough current to fully engage itself. The motor itself appears to do nothing when this happens presumably because it's not engaging the switch at the back of the solenoid.
 
It might be a long shot, but check your earthing. I had a peculiar issue with lighting, where I was getting power when I had my meter on it, but nothing when I put the fitting on. Came down to a poor earth connection. Worth a look?
 
DanBerry said:
It might be a long shot, but check your earthing. I had a peculiar issue with lighting, where I was getting power when I had my meter on it, but nothing when I put the fitting on. Came down to a poor earth connection. Worth a look?
Click to expand...

Dead on!

EARTH --- EARTH ------EARTH!!!!!

Start with the battery earth connection - like, take it OFF, clean it inside and SCRAPE the battery post. NEVER use sand paper or emery for this job.

Leave it off meantime.

Now follow the big black earth cable to where it meets the main earth point. TAKE IT OFF, and clean and scrape all surfaces, a little copper-grease, and bolt it back on snug and firm.

Now find the main earth strap or cable from BODY TO CHASSIS, and undo and clean bother ends, repalcing with a little copper grease to help keep water out.

Now find the main earth strap or cable from CHASSIS TO ENGINE. Sort its ends out just the same.

Feel free to ADD an extra bloody big earth cable from as near battery NEG as you can get, direct to any bloody big available bolt on the engine block.

Let us know how you resolve this.

CharlesY
 
CharlesY said:
Start with the battery earth connection - like, take it OFF, clean it inside and SCRAPE the battery post. NEVER use sand paper or emery for this job.

CharlesY
Click to expand...

Why don't you recommend emery to clean the terminal, CharlesY?
 
If you stick a decent jump lead straight from the neg terminal of the battery, to the body of the starter and it starts ok then its definatley a poor earth.

Might be quicker to try this first, before you pull the car apart.

Hope this helps, Dave
 
Cheers fellas. I'm still investigating the issue. Will have more time to work on it tomorrow.

I'm usure whether it is the earth or not as I have cleaned and secured the earth for the starter but I'm considering putting a direct earth to where the starter lies as I have some heavy duty cabling nocking around.

I was thinking it could also be a live fault as the previous owner had a manual ignition switch installed with all kinds of messy wiring that I have been tracing. Although so far no break or loose connection in it that I can see and any connectors I have found have been reterminated.

One question I do have though, is it normal to have a relay to switch the ignition because at present the switch in the cab is directly engaging the solenoid.

I would imagine btw that the reason you don't clean battery terminals with emery is because it leaves behind bits of emery in the surface of the terminals which will increase your impedence. The recommended way is to use a wire brush iirc.
 
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GRATCH said:
Why don't you recommend emery to clean the terminal, CharlesY?
Click to expand...


The grit comes off the emery and tends to get embedded in the lead posts of the battery. The grit is a NON conductor of electricity and tends to hold the clamp away from the post. In a bad case it can cause trouble, including arcing between the clamp and the post. If there is any space between the post and the clamp then water and air can get in, and corrosion will follow very quickly. A few tiny bits of grit can cause quite a lot of bother.

It's just one of those things it is as well not to do.

Scrape them gently clean is a better way, then a little copper-grease or Vaseline on them to stop corrosion.

CharlesY
 
Hiddenpower said:
I would imagine btw that the reason you don't clean battery terminals with emery is because it leaves behind bits of emery in the surface of the terminals which will increase your impedence. The recommended way is to use a wire brush iirc.
Click to expand...

CharlesY said:
The grit comes off the emery and tends to get embedded in the lead posts of the battery. The grit is a NON conductor of electricity and tends to hold the clamp away from the post. In a bad case it can cause trouble, including arcing between the clamp and the post. If there is any space between the post and the clamp then water and air can get in, and corrosion will follow very quickly. A few tiny bits of grit can cause quite a lot of bother.

It's just one of those things it is as well not to do.

Scrape them gently clean is a better way, then a little copper-grease or Vaseline on them to stop corrosion.

CharlesY
Click to expand...

Ok, seeing the logic here. I usually do boiling water, emery, wire brush then, when clean, vaseline.




























There's a siggy for someone:doh::rolleyes:
 
Hey guys, just an update. The problem appears resolved now. I discovered a frayed earth lead on the other end of the battery mounts. I have since replaced the lead, cleaned all of the contacts with a wire brush and copperslipped the hell out of them. Currently starting every time on the button again.

Thanks a bunch for the help.
 
Unfortunately I was mistaken. The problem has been reduced enough that I can start her when i want now but I still get the same clunk of the solenoid going on without a motor engagement. The earths have all been cleaned/replaced so I'm wondering what else might be causing this issue. At some stage I will open up the wiring to see if there are any feed problems but the fact that it worked off my car says to me that it's either a mechanical obstruction or an electrical fault.
 
So with our recent bout of snow the starter failed on me. I spent the weekend before christmas taking the old one out and replacing it with a handy spare. She now starts on the button every time. I note that on the old starter the wear marks are only part way along the pinion gear indicating that the solenoid wasn't engaging properly.

The old one shall be refurbed in time and given to the donor whom my current starter is from.

Thanks for all the help guys.
 
It is probably the SOLENOID needing some attention.

They CAN be taken off and stripped, but usually there's a wire to unsolder.

There are two threaded rods sticking out the end.
Usually these are copper bolts. The heads of the bolts are inside.
When you turn the key to starter, the solenoid coil rams a big copper bar across the heads of the two bolts, and the starter current flows across them.

The BAR and the heads of the bolts get burned. Turn the bar so the other side faces the bolts, and file the tops of the bolt heads so they are flat and shiny.

Another plan is a recon starter with a guarantee.

CharlesY
 
No need to remove manifolds to get at starter only exaust downpipe,unless its a disco unit.
 
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