After talking to my insurance today, they reckon I'll get an offer before the end of the week wonder how much it will be bet it's nowhere near the 5.5k I paid for it.
Looking for a replacement now, with a bit of luck I'll find another good one in time for me to go to France fishing on the 25th.

Tervueren said:

After talking to my insurance today, they reckon I'll get an offer before the end of the week wonder how much it will be bet it's nowhere near the 5.5k I paid for it.
Looking for a replacement now, with a bit of luck I'll find another good one in time for me to go to France fishing on the 25th.

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dont except their first offer and have a rant and kick up
where ya off to in france bud ? hope you have more luck than i did in may

Hi Buckshot, fishing near to Orconte, was over there the 1st week in May this year and had around a dozen upto 43lbs, hopefully I'll do better this trip.

Insurance companies exist to make PROFITS.

They do this by taking in more cash than they pay out.

In your case, you have a CONTRACT with them, whereby in return for you paying them a premium, they agree to INDEMNIFY you in the event certain things happen, like the car is written off or stolen.

INDEMNIFY means they must place you in the same financial situation AFTER the loss as you were in just before the loss.

If the car was WORTH £5,500 they MUST offer to pay you that, like MUST. The have an enforcible CONTRACT with you that says so. The problem is agreeing the value at the time of the claim. You will probably be negotiating with a loss adjuster, and his first question will be to ask what you paid for the car. Tell him to mind his own business! DO NOT TELL HIM WHAT YOU PAID FOR THE CAR!!!

If you do, he will definitely offer less than that.

Taking it to an extreme (reductio ad absurdum) , if you had been GIVEN the car (so it cost you NOTHING) would that mean the insurance company could say you have suffered no loss and we ain't paying? NO WAY!!! You lost a Landy WORTH £5,500 and that is what they must pay, even if you made a good buy and paid only £2,000 for it.

NEVER EVER TELL AN INSURANCE ASSESSOR WHAT YOU PAID FOR A CAR.
Just start telling him what it was WORTH. If you can't agree with the assessor don't take any crap from him - complain DIRECT to your insurance company.

Trust me. You are paying a premium for INDEMNITY, not to be ripped-off.

CharlesY

Oops, they requested certain documents when it was stolen including the 'bill of sale' which I duly sent including photos of the car which I only bought on the 17th July stolen on 28th August !!

CharlesY said:

Insurance companies exist to make PROFITS.

They do this by taking in more cash than they pay out.

In your case, you have a CONTRACT with them, whereby in return for you paying them a premium, they agree to INDEMNIFY you in the event certain things happen, like the car is written off or stolen.

INDEMNIFY means they must place you in the same financial situation AFTER the loss as you were in just before the loss.

If the car was WORTH £5,500 they MUST offer to pay you that, like MUST. The have an enforcible CONTRACT with you that says so. The problem is agreeing the value at the time of the claim. You will probably be negotiating with a loss adjuster, and his first question will be to ask what you paid for the car. Tell him to mind his own business! DO NOT TELL HIM WHAT YOU PAID FOR THE CAR!!!

If you do, he will definitely offer less than that.

Taking it to an extreme (reductio ad absurdum) , if you had been GIVEN the car (so it cost you NOTHING) would that mean the insurance company could say you have suffered no loss and we ain't paying? NO WAY!!! You lost a Landy WORTH £5,500 and that is what they must pay, even if you made a good buy and paid only £2,000 for it.

NEVER EVER TELL AN INSURANCE ASSESSOR WHAT YOU PAID FOR A CAR.
Just start telling him what it was WORTH. If you can't agree with the assessor don't take any crap from him - complain DIRECT to your insurance company.

Trust me. You are paying a premium for INDEMNITY, not to be ripped-off.

CharlesY

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I completely agree with CharlesY.
Never tell them what you paid because its got nothing to do with anything. If they continue to pratt about and make derisory offers just tell them to source the equivalent vehicle in terms of condition AND mileage and put the onus back on the Insurance company. Also give them a deadline of say 28 days to settle or you'll start breach of contract proceedings in the courts. Its not expensive and they'll soon realise that you are not the usual easy push over and their attitude will become much more sensible.
I did this when my Cosworth Sierra was nicked and they ended up paying me more than 4 times their original offer rather than go to court or spend time and money finding a replacement vehicle. This was all settled within 14 days of me standing my ground. Needless to say I never did get another Cosworth but spent the money on my Defender and a family holiday to keep 'er indoors sweet.

Tervueren said:

Oops, they requested certain documents when it was stolen including the 'bill of sale' which I duly sent including photos of the car which I only bought on the 17th July stolen on 28th August !!

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The bill of sale merely proves that you bought the vehicle. If you got it cheap then good for you, if you paid too much then so what, what relevance does that have? They have to replace the vehicle or give you enough money to allow you to realistically replace the vehicle with the same or similar. If they can find the equivalent vehicle for the same or less money then you'll have no argument BUT they want you to spend time and money hunting around with no garauntee that you will be able to find one at or around the same price. Therefore they are obliged to pay out the market rate. If they ask you to find adverts for similar vehicles go to your main LR dealers and do as they ask. Dont fanny about in the cheap ads. Tell them that you will be claiming for your time, loss of earnings, and expenses for doing this which you are perfectly entitled to do.

Taking CharlesY's example to even more extremes what if you'd bought a rare classic such as a Shelby Cobra when they were new? They are now worth 20+ times what you would have paid - assuming you could find one for sale. Would they give you your original £12K and tell you to f**k off?

Ta for all the advice, rest assured I won't let them shaft me

Tervueren said:

Ta for all the advice, rest assured I won't let them shaft me

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What happened?

Did you get sorted out?

CharlesY

"you'll start breach of contract proceedings in the courts."

By all means as a threat but be careful. Your claim cannot exceed the small claims limit of £5K. Costs in the 'fast track' will exceed the vehicles value and may not be recoverable. You will need to demonstate that you have followed the insurers-lengthy- complaints procedure prior to issuing proceedings otherwise you could be penalised for acting prematurely.You will need independant and expert opinion on the vehicles value. Sorry to disagree with the others but the purchase price will be relevant if you persue through a court and must be disclosed. If the insurers final offer is not bettered by a judgement you'll be ordered to pay the insurers costs.
Summary: avoid court action unless you have very deep pockets.

gardeners26 said:

"you'll start breach of contract proceedings in the courts."

By all means as a threat but be careful. Your claim cannot exceed the small claims limit of £5K. Costs in the 'fast track' will exceed the vehicles value and may not be recoverable. You will need to demonstate that you have followed the insurers-lengthy- complaints procedure prior to issuing proceedings otherwise you could be penalised for acting prematurely.You will need independant and expert opinion on the vehicles value. Sorry to disagree with the others but the purchase price will be relevant if you persue through a court and must be disclosed. If the insurers final offer is not bettered by a judgement you'll be ordered to pay the insurers costs.
Summary: avoid court action unless you have very deep pockets.

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Agreed nearly all that EXCEPT that while you MAY be asked to disclose a purchase price, that is not a relevant factor upon which to base the value at the time of the loss. I am perfectly sure a court will agree with that. If it had been a brand new Landy bought at full retail price then the purchase price might be a factor, but not with a used vehicle whose real value could vary so much between a "banger" and a "one lady owner" sort of thing. You bought THAT Landy at THAT price because you thought THAT Landy at THAT price was way under-priced and super value.

The insurers have the right at their option to replace the car with one about the same. Invite them to do so. They definitely won't because if they do they have to stand warranty on it and carry the can if they force a duffer on you. So PRESS THEM HARD to get you a car as good as your one! They'll buy you off with a decent offer soon enough to get out of that trap, because they know how much trouble it will be to get a good one, and how much trouble it could be if it breaks down.

It never does any harm to say you are becoming fed up with their prevarication, but you will NOT "cut your losses" and are taking advice about legal action, and building up a case for valuation from LR experts.

Keep on at them about INDEMNITY - you want a car that YOU agree is as good as the one you lost, or enough cash as to give you a chance of getting one like it. INDEMNITY.

CharlesY

CharlesY said:

Agreed nearly all that EXCEPT that while you MAY be asked to disclose a purchase price, that is not a relevant factor upon which to base the value at the time of the loss. I am perfectly sure a court will agree with that. If it had been a brand new Landy bought at full retail price then the purchase price might be a factor, but not with a used vehicle whose real value could vary so much between a "banger" and a "one lady owner" sort of thing. You bought THAT Landy at THAT price because you thought THAT Landy at THAT price was way under-priced and super value.

The insurers have the right at their option to replace the car with one about the same. Invite them to do so. The definitely won't because if they do they have to stand warranty on it and carry the can if they force a duffer on you. So PRESS THEM HARD to get you a car as good as your one! They'll buy you off with a decent offer soon enough to get out of that trap, because they know how much trouble it will be to get a good one, and how much trouble it could be if it breaks down.

It never does any harm to say you are becoming fed up with their prevarication, but you will NOT "cut your losses" and are taking advice about legal action, and building up a case for valuation from LR experts.

Keep on at them about INDEMNITY - you want a car that YOU agree is as good as the one you lost, or enough cash as to give you a chance of getting one like it. INDEMNITY.

CharlesY

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Could not have put it better myself.
Dont let the bast*rds grind you down.