hehe

hughesy said:

I know what bio-diesel is made from. I also know that from a customs and excise point of view bio-diesel and veg oil are two different things. We've been through all this before and I can't be arsed doing it again but next time you see the ministry blokes pulling wagons over to give them the once over why not pull up alongside, tell them your tank is full of veg oil that you have no intention of paying any duty on, and see what happens. Don't forget to post the results on here for us all to enjoy.

Click to expand...

If you'd clicked the link I posted earlier and bothered to read through it you'd have found this post.

See my email to HMRC and their reply below.

Hello
I am investigating using a form of biofuel in my vehicle.
This is liable to be a prepared mix of vegetable oil (either waste or new
oil) and regular duty paid diesel.
Amount of vegetable oil to be used per year is estimated to be around 1500L
but certainly less than the 2500L limit that is getting mentioned on the
internet.

After reading much on the internet and your own website I am somewhat
confused as to requirements to register etc.

Please advise what procedure is required to register, if still required,
and please forward any necessary forms to the address below.




HMRC answer

Date 18 July 2007

Reference C6529

Dear Mr

Vegetable Oil/DERV mixture

Thank you for your e-mail dated 12 July 2007 regarding the use of vegetable oil and DERV mixture in your car and whether you have to register with H M Revenue and Customs [HMRC].

The changes brought in under the ‘Biofuels Simplification’ [Revenue and Customs Brief 43/07] whereby producers of biofuels (or other fuel substitutes) who produce (or use) less than 2,500 litres per annum, will no longer be required to make entry, render returns or pay duty, are intended to cover both those who produce or use biofuels (such as biodiesel, or bioethanol), and those who produce or use other ‘fuel substitutes’ (such as vegetable oil).

Anyone producing (or using) more than 2,500 litres per annum will have to make entry of their premises (register), render returns and pay duty.

Where producers or users will exceed 2,500 litres per annum, then they need to make entry of their premises, render returns and pay duty in accordance with Public Notice 179e (which is currently being amended to reflect the recent changes).

For those producers who are ‘registered’ there will remain a continuing requirement for them to show that the fuel that they produce (or use) is Biodiesel (and meets the fiscal definition in HODA) and where this is not the case, they will continue to be liable to the higher rate of duty on the biofuel they produce (or use) at the higher Fuel Substitute rate.

Revenue and Customs Brief 43/07
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/briefs/excise-duty/brief4307.htm

Public Notice 179E
http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsPortalWebApp/channelsPortalWebApp.portal?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=pageLibrary_PublicNoticesAndInfoSh eets&propertyType=document&columns=1&id=HMCE_CL_000205

I hope the above information is satisfactory, but if you have any further queries regarding this matter, please do not hesitate to contact the address shown above quoting our reference number.

Yours sincerely



Mr D J Emmerson
Written Enquiries Officer

And this post

Sorry for being such a doubting Thomas earlier on in the thread!!
I've now done a bit more research (to satisfy myself and the other scheptics amongst us).
I emailed the "main man" dealing with this issue at HM Revenue & Customs & this was his reply:

"Dear Jeff

Yes, it is legal to use any fuel substitute (at least from the tax point of view), and the 2,500 litres and under exemption applies to them all. A while ago, it was not legal to use vegetable oil, but it became legal some time ago. Tax was due on it and other fuel substitutes up to 30 June 2007. It still is, but only to individuals and groups producing more than 2,500 litres per year.

Your colleagues in the motoring club should be aware that if they use the same equipment, or the same premises, the production output of the people doing the sharing has to be added together, so if five individuals are sharing the same premises or equipment, and each one is under the limit but as a group they are over it, each of them will have to register the premises that they use - it may be the same premises – and account for their own part of the duty, as they would have had to do anyway for any tiny amount up to 30 June 2007.

I hope this answers your question. If you need further clarification, please let me know.

Regards

Tony"

Good man Red. That's a pretty clear response to the question. Thank god thats cleared up.

It's also about having alternatives. A few years ago they were fighting in the streets after 2 weeks shortage of fuel. There appears to be only a thin veneer of civilised behaviour that holds the country together. once that gets rubbed away all hell breaks loose. Roll on the fall of government and the advent of anachy.

Vote for Dirty Hands

Redhand I have read all that now and I'm starting to believe it. However there's still a lot of conflicting information out there along with loads of pure hearsay and peoples opinions. Still very dificult to make an informed decision about what is and isn't legal.

Yes, but where does it say to be used in a road vehicle it only says "using", if you look there is no definate answer, they are keeping it vague.

Hi,

Yes you can mix small quantities of veg oil in with you diesel, just put in the tank, although I would not recommend high leval's without conversion. Doing so will stress your injection pump considerably due to the high viscosity of veg oil when not heated. This could result in failier or a reduced life of your pump (and they are not cheap). You should look at doing a dual tank conversion or at least fitting a heat exchanger (not electric glow plug type) We manufacture Veg Oil Heat Exchangers our web site is Sunshine Fuel - Diesel to Vegetable oil conversions

Regards

Mike Gaylor