A

adh

Member
Had a very scary moment in my basic (no abs) 90 yesterday when my brakes seemed to go to about 10% effort for no apparent reason.

Had just done about 40 miles down the motorway with an unbraked trailer of no more than about 1/2 a tone gros with little braking and then about 2 miles on and of the brakes steadily but fairly steep downhill lanes.

The brakes worked perfectly fine untill I started driving through the level village at the bottom and I slowed for a bike in front of me and though I might be knocking him off!

Took it very steady through the village and trying the brakes. They gradually felt I bit more lively but when I stoped the rear wheels were hot and a bit smelly. Fronts just normal warm.

drove on another 15 miles over the hills with the brakes working fine and wheels all warm/cool when I stopped.

Changed the front pads a few weeks back (for mintex) before the MOT with one pad a bit more worn than the rest, but disks and rear pads looked fine.

It doesn't pull to one side or anything, but I have noticed one of the back brakes binding in the past on a couple of random ocasions and asked the dealer to check it at service.

It's just gone out of warrenty (3 years old) last week. Great!

The only other thing noteworthy, but I can't see how it could have caused it, I was probably freewheeling down the hill most of the way. Right or wrong I can't see the point of messing about with the gears and wasting fuel when your foot's on and off the the brake constantly and with no significantload on them.

Maybe this was a bit heavy to be doing that, but have done similar descents with two tone trailers, not freewheeling obviousley, but with very dubious trailer brakes so I know brake fade isn't normaly a concern.

Also the front brakes (which do pretty much all the work) weren't hot?

Anyone any Ideas before I consider arguing it out with the dealer?:confused:
 
Last edited:
adh said:
Had a very scary moment in my basic (no abs) 90 yesterday when my brakes seemed to go to about 10% effort for no apparent reason.

Had just done about 40 miles down the motorway with an unbraked trailer of no more than about 1/2 a tone gros with little braking and then about 2 miles on and of the brakes steadily but fairly steep downhill lanes.

The brakes worked perfectly fine untill I started driving through the level village at the bottom and I slowed for a bike in front of me and though I might be knocking him off!

Took it very steady through the village and trying the brakes. They gradually felt I bit more lively but when I stoped the rear wheels were hot and a bit smelly. Fronts just normal warm.

drove on another 15 miles over the hills with the brakes working fine and wheels all warm/cool when I stopped.

Changed the front pads a few weeks back (for mintex) before the MOT with one pad a bit more worn than the rest, but disks and rear pads looked fine.

It doesn't pull to one side or anything, but I have noticed one of the back brakes binding in the past on a couple of random ocasions and asked the dealer to check it at service.

It's just gone out of warrenty (3 years old) last week. Great!

The only other thing noteworthy, but I can't see how it could have caused it, I was probably freewheeling down the hill most of the way. Right or wrong I can't see the point of messing about with the gears and wasting fuel when your foot's on and off the the brake constantly.

Have done similar descents with two tone trailers with verry dubious trailer brakes so I know brake fade shouldn't be a concern normally

Also the front brakes (which do pretty much all the work) weren't hot?

Anyone any Ideas before I consider arguing it out with the dealer?:confused:
Click to expand...


plenty of clues in there, as for free wheeling down hills, have you not heard of engine braking, it uses next to no fuel on the over run and would have probably saved you the dirty undercrackers you obviously had, may i suggest before you have a crack at the dealers replace all your pads with the same brand and try engaging your brain and the gears on descents.
 
Well put DiscoPol. Learn to drive properly with or without a trailer. If you are in the right gear for any descent you should not need any brakes to control your speed in most situations. Its not only your life at risk.
 
adh said:
Right or wrong I can't see the point of messing about with the gears and wasting fuel when your foot's on and off the the brake constantly.
Click to expand...

I think the other guys have pointed to your braking issues however another thing I would like to point out is that your comment above is incorrect, coasting down a hill in gear will use NO fuel, free wheeling with the engine idling will use fuel.

Here is the theory: at 30mph in 3rd gear your engine will probably be doing 2000rpm, or 1500rpm in 4th. assuming your not trying to drive it faster down said hill your foot will be off the throttle, therefore the driver demand is 0%, engine on it's own wants to be at idle speed, so it essentially stops injecting or injects a VERY small amount of fuel until it's slowed to 750rpm.

With a big trailer going down hill in ones of these, 3rd or 4th is pretty good at keeping it at about the 30 mark (depending on gradient) and you will need no brakes. If you need to drop gear while going down the hill to help with your engine braking then, dip the clutch while lifting the revs (and if your good add some brake in too to help the effort) before dropping it into the lower gear. This reduces the stress on the drivetrain considerably. If you do it properly you will be able to feel a very smooth gearchange with no hesitation on the box at all.
 
When I did my HGV training back in the day I was told to select the correct gear at the top or bottom of a gradient that would mean I could go completely up or down without having to change gears halfway. No chance of a false nuetral leaving you relying solely on the brakes.
 
ADH don't say where he/she is, but my advice would be to learn to drive your Landy porperly first, possibly by going out with any real Landy owners in your area!

Otherwise, you are not only a potential danger to your Landy, you are a danger to all other road users!!!
 
All very interesting and probably valid points.
But all completely out of context, probably due to my discription.

I said it was a steep hill but It wasn't realy that bad. I'm talking 30/40mph with a quick dab on the brakes at corners etc every so ofton down the way. I was wanting to go quite quick down the hill.

I have probably driven more trailers and heavy trailers down hills than anyone commenting. Including 10 tone traillers behind tractors.

Of Course you use suitable low gears to control the weight of the vehicle if the weight of the trailer is not easily managable by the brakes.

If the weight is easily mangeable and you don't want to crawl down at a rediculously slow speed, then I don't see the problem on relying on the brakes (If they work properly

I have a tractor that I would never ever consider going down a hill with without first considering the right gear to be in and avoiding having to use the brakes at all.

I have another that a lot of the time I would use the gears to slow me with a heavy load, but never with a light load. Because the brakes are very very good and my time is worth a lot more than a bit of brake lining. Ohh and I have never ever had significant brake fade with this tractor.

I can't see why a nealy new landrover with what seem to be very good brakes, should be any different than anything else ( if the brakes are working as normal).

I'm interested in the comment of fuel. I genuinely would like to know if this is correct and I'm not saying it isn't. But why does my car, with a digital fuel display use a hell of a lot less fuel when you are coasting(in or out of gear) as aposed to easing of in a low gear? Surely the egine is still pumping fuel through to match the speed of the engine, or is it that the computers are suposed to cut the fuel if theres no load??
 
If you are relying on your brakes for control downhill, rather than using the braking power of the engine, I am hopefully never going to find myself anywhere near you!!

FFS Learn to drive properly ... And I don't care what you have driven, or how big it was, you are a danger to yourself and everyone else on the roads!!
 
I would have hoped for a little more open mindedness and less abusivness on a forum like this.
Yes of course you should use engine gearing where heavy loads and steep/slippy decents are needed. Agree whole hartedly.
But the brakes arn't there for decoration. They should and do work perfectly well on there own most of the time when conditions dictate.

By the by on a fast mainroad run off the tops yesterday in gear etc the brakes were spot on but did seam pretty hot when I parked up. and a bit smelly. They never usually do this, so there is definately somthing a mis with them.

Rears were hot, fronts not so bad but still seemed a bit smelly.

Are there any common problems that may be causing this. Don't know if there's a load sensor on a landrover?
 
The Mad Hat Man said:
Read the highway code about coasting.
Click to expand...
So you follow everything the highway code tells you do you.....right:D

Seriously though, I didn't see costing being such a big deal at the right time and place (Ie with no load or light load on the vehicle), but going off the comments on here ok maybe I'm wrong. I'm happy to take on positive criticism if it's backed up properly, not just abusive, don't see the need for that.

As for being a danger to other road users......quite often I just jump in the motor and drive off without checking the condition of my tires or anything. Maybe a little dangerous thinking about it, but hey I never said I was perfect.
I guess all the other people commenting check their vehicles maticulously (as in the highway code) and they wash off their vehicle after an off roading challenge to check the condition of all the tires and brake pipes for scrapes before driving off.

Or maybe they just jump in and if evrything feels allright, then fine.

Come on guys lighten up a bit! Bit of advice and a banter is what it's about aint it?:confused:
 
Ok fair enough. I promise I will try to get a little closser to perfection as well:)

I will be out in the Landy later and with the snow and ice round ours at the mo, I can assure you I won't be relying on anything other than my gears to keep me on the straight and narrow.
Though my new mud terains don't seem to be particularly good for that unless they have 2 foot of snow to chew through. Didn't realise they would be so crap on thiner snow/ice. My half bald road mitchelins were a lot better.
 
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