blue beasty said:

All true no doubt but almost total reliance on the financial sector and the demise of industry sit squarely on Thatchers shoulders.

Blaming one party or another is pointless when a succession of both in power have been heading the same direction and make future choices pretty dire.

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Datatek said:

Not the unions then
The dead unburied, rubbish not collected the 3 day week due to power shortages etc etc.

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Volusia said:

Having been in a position to pose the question of his raid on pension funds in the first year he carried out the theft of 5 billion pounds from said funds, I have to admit Brown gave a good, almost convincing, account of his actions. But agree, no government, whatever it's colour has the nounce to run the country, which is run by faceless civil servants anyway. But one fact remains, if you need to raise money you have to raise it from the hordes rather than who we would all like to see it raised from, the bankers. If Britain lost its banking sector, the apprentices you speak of who were dropped in favour of bussing in cheap labour voting workers, would not have anything to be apprenticed at. It seems all that is left in the UK is service industries, the city and precious little else. Even the Electrical distribution and supply companies, a core element to civilized living, dropped apprentiships thanks to labours so short sighted plans to keep folk like Millipede and Andy ( mid staffs) Burnham in office at all costs.

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blue beasty said:

To some extent yes but the real killer was carving up the unregulated banking sector with Reagan and making a choice to rely on banking instead of manufacturing output to keep the economy afloat.

It's a situation that's very hard to back out of. Our GDP is made of smoke and mirrors.

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wattfield said:

I actually agree with much of that, although if you classify what Gordon Brown did to pension funds as theft, then so are all other taxes. Not that I think he was right. Incidentally, my father worked for one of those electrical supply companies ( the only one at the time, being a nationalised industry). Their apprenticeships stopped when Andy Burnham was 12 years old, and my Dad moved to another job, as he trained apprentices until then. My grandfather and great grandfather worked for the same company, and if those apprenticeships had continued for another year, so would I.

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Bennehboy said:

Driven to Normandy a few times via Dieppe, the roads are an absolute pleasure. Only bit that's crap is going over the Pont De Normandie, queues can get a bit long.

Got stopped by the Gendarmerie once but that was just a random stop at a roundabout, checked my license, reg, insurance and set me on my way. They weren't at all snotty.

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Bobsticle said:

It is also an offence to raise a firearm if in the company of a German. You must drop it immediately and run away awaiting the arrival of other nationalities to pull you out of the ****.

:bounce:

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Datatek said:

Yep can be a bit of a queue, but Reims is no longer a problem. Calais/Dover is much worse for jams at one end or the other.

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Bennehboy said:

Gonna do Cherbourg next year, didn't realise Brittania ferries have a 'club' that knocks loads off the price. Newhaven Dieppe was ~500 quid for the D2 (5 of us) this year and the no discount price for Cherbourg was over 800!!!! Workmate pointed it out literally a couple days after I'd coughed up.

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Datatek said:

Newhaven Dieppe £500 I paid £104 return last year with 2 people.
If you cross regularly, the Brittany Ferries club is worth while. Once a year and it's not.
If you are travelling peak period and your day/time is flexible can be done for £309 Newhaven Dieppe

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