Lej · Feb 16, 2022

Hi guys,

Just wondering if it's worth taking the head completely off to replace the stem seals. I am aware that there's a tool to do it in situ, however I'm having problems with smoke with different hues, I'm thinking for the sake of a few extra hours a top end and injector clean and refurb might be the better option.

Is this an easier way of doing it? Many thanks in advance!

lynall · Feb 17, 2022

Not done them in situ, but I bet if you have a google it is possible and someone somewhere will have done it as the valves are dead straight down onto the piston tops.
Normally valve stem seals only cause smoke on cold start.

Have you checked the injector pump timing?
Also worth checking the crank bolt is tight and more importantly even if the bolt is tight that the pulley does not move either way as you rotate the crank back and forth, not seen it for am long time but a slack crank pulley eventually wears out the cranks keyways giving you variable valve and injector pump timing, not good!

200 are a bit of a dirty engine even when everything is spot on, and if the pump has been tweaked even slightly you will see smoke especially at this time of year in the following cars headlamps

Hicap phill · Feb 17, 2022

It’s easier to strip down than in situ.

Lej · Feb 17, 2022

lynall said:
Not done them in situ, but I bet if you have a google it is possible and someone somewhere will have done it as the valves are dead straight down onto the piston tops.
Normally valve stem seals only cause smoke on cold start.

Have you checked the injector pump timing?
Also worth checking the crank bolt is tight and more importantly even if the bolt is tight that the pulley does not move either way as you rotate the crank back and forth, not seen it for am long time but a slack crank pulley eventually wears out the cranks keyways giving you variable valve and injector pump timing, not good!

200 are a bit of a dirty engine even when everything is spot on, and if the pump has been tweaked even slightly you will see smoke especially at this time of year in the following cars headlamps

The smoke is more of an issue on start up, it is a very lumpy idle even in hot weather. If I put my foot on the accelerator it splutters to a normal rhythm and after a couple of minutes it runs okis but still sounds like an injector spray pattern is wrong.

I'll take a look at your suggestions, much appreciated for the help!

Britcyclerider · Feb 17, 2022

Did my 200 stem seals in situ last year. Not difficult but a bit fiddly. Made a simple tool from a 6 mm thick strip of steel. Two of the seals had become unseated from the guide and had ridden up the valve stem.

From the above, it sounds like you have other issues which I would look into before tackling the stem seals.

Britcyclerider · Feb 17, 2022

Forgot to mention that there are some good videos on youTube explaining how to rebuild 200 TDI injectors. Ideally they should be leak and pressure tested, but you can clean the nozzles yourself if you are desperate.

lynall · Feb 17, 2022

Lej said:
The smoke is more of an issue on start up, it is a very lumpy idle even in hot weather. If I put my foot on the accelerator it splutters to a normal rhythm and after a couple of minutes it runs okis but still sounds like an injector spray pattern is wrong.

I'll take a look at your suggestions, much appreciated for the help!

Could be you are pulling air in, the leak off pipes between the injectors perish and can allow air into the system.
The inj pump is pretty much self bleeding so will try and sort itself out.

A large chuff of black smoke on start up isnt unusual or smoke with large throttle openings at low rpms.

Maybe start from the tank and investigate every pipe/fitting ?

lynall · Feb 17, 2022

I forgot to ask what car is the engine in? 200 disco had a fuel sedimentor over the rear axle that rots out, disco fuel pick up pipes rot out, could also be a dodgy lift pump letting air in, they are not much cop these days.

Lej · Feb 17, 2022

The smoke is a white/grey smoke, no blue or black from what I can see. It's smoking too much for my liking and I'd say it's not normal at all.

After further investigation I have found an oil leak going through to the glow plugs. At this point it's more of a uh-oh analysis and I'm thinking it's best to do a complete top end refurb which gives me an option to look at the piston rings.

At least if I overhaul the top end then I can start a process of elimination when it comes to fueling.

The engine is in a defender but it's a discovery conversion and all the spill pipes have been replaced.

Think I'm looking at an overall bigger problem at this rate, sadly

Lej · Feb 17, 2022

There's also a lot of soot/carbon that comes out of the exhaust when I put my foot down on start up, what would this indicate?

Flossie · Feb 17, 2022

I'd get a compression test done first or your wasting time and money doing the injectors and pulling the head etc.
Crank pulley is a good check, costs nowt, timing check is easy enough as long as the camshaft was set up correctly on the last belt change.

Lej · Feb 17, 2022

Flossie said:
I'd get a compression test done first or your wasting time and money doing the injectors and pulling the head etc.
Crank pulley is a good check, costs nowt, timing check is easy enough as long as the camshaft was set up correctly on the last belt change.

I'll take a look at that first before I start ripping things apart.

What exactly am I looking for in regards to the crank pulley?

Thank you all!

lynall · Feb 17, 2022

Lej said:
The smoke is a white/grey smoke, no blue or black from what I can see. It's smoking too much for my liking and I'd say it's not normal at all.

After further investigation I have found an oil leak going through to the glow plugs. At this point it's more of a uh-oh analysis and I'm thinking it's best to do a complete top end refurb which gives me an option to look at the piston rings.

At least if I overhaul the top end then I can start a process of elimination when it comes to fueling.

The engine is in a defender but it's a discovery conversion and all the spill pipes have been replaced.

Think I'm looking at an overall bigger problem at this rate, sadly

iI reckon thats going to be timing related, ie shes injecting late and its not all getting burnt
Timing pin kit off ebay is about 20/25 quid, simple to do, if not sure take a look on youtube as there are several videos to do with pump timing of the Bosch VE.
Pin kit pretty much an essential bit of 200/300 maintainence kit.

It could also be injectors but the timing is much cheaper to check/adjust than 4 recon injectors to start with.

Flossie · Feb 17, 2022

Crank pully- probably best to slacken the belt then see if there is clockwise/ anti clockwise movement by hand. Then see if it will wiggle about in relation to the bonded rubber.

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