m4drx · Feb 13, 2014

Hi guys,

Can't post in common questions and I didn't want to restrict to just discos as this engine is defenders etc.

I have a 200tdi Disco 1 which is very underpowered. I have been using it the last year on lanes and pay n play days without too much issue and just presumed that's how they all are but I don't think thats the case now.

It essentially pulls ok to about 2800rpm and then its like hitting a brick wall or rev limit as it just does not want to go any higher. If you keep your foot down, it will rev higher but it just seems brutal.

I've changed the oil, air filter, oil filter and fuel filter which has made no difference. I checked the turbo which only has minor play and no end float. The intercooler pipes are not leaking and inlet manifold doesn't seem to be either.

It puts out a fairly consistent fog of black smoke when accelerating so seems to be unburnt fuel but I can't see why.

Any help appreciated.

sprogthedog · Feb 13, 2014

Have you checked the pipes internally? They may be collapsing at higher revs, restricting airflow.

m4drx · Feb 13, 2014

I have checked the intercooler pipes and they seem fine. They would bulge under positive boost so wouldn't collapse. I did check and the turbo is producing boost and the top pipe does firm up when the engine is revved and a little boost produced.

I'm thinking maybe its fuel pump related? Perhaps over fueling? Or something more common that I'm not aware of.

lpoolalan · Feb 13, 2014

I had the exact same problem but mine was my air filter and you have changed yours so cant be that, I also had the pipe from my airbox collapsing under boost (2800-3000rpm ish)

owl · Feb 13, 2014

You need to take the turbo/ intercooler pipes off and look inside, they delaminate so might be bulging outside but a flap inside is restricting the flow. also check that the fuel lift pump is working.

m4drx · Feb 13, 2014

I'll check again. My inlet pipe from the airbox to the turbo is a metal one with some sort of wrapping? It looks oem but not sure if it is. I'll take it off and check it properly.

It is fitted with a snorkel so maybe that has something to do with it, i'm not sure.

If you're issue was at 2800-3000rpm, it sounds like mine may well be air inlet related.

m4drx · Feb 13, 2014

how do I check the fuel lift pump?

lpoolalan · Feb 13, 2014

m4drx said:
I'll check again. My inlet pipe from the airbox to the turbo is a metal one with some sort of wrapping? It looks oem but not sure if it is. I'll take it off and check it properly.

It is fitted with a snorkel so maybe that has something to do with it, i'm not sure.

If you're issue was at 2800-3000rpm, it sounds like mine may well be air inlet related.

Mine got to 2800-3000 rpm and felt like it was hitting a rev limiter and blowing smoke out the back like I have never seen, Where you intercooler pipes clean inside or did they have oil in? take the air filter out and take it around the block, thats how i found out mine was intake related.

lpoolalan · Feb 13, 2014

m4drx said:
how do I check the fuel lift pump?

Disconnect the pipe that goes from the pump to the filter, take off the fuel cut off wire from the back of the pump, then turn the engine over and see how much diesel comes out.

m4drx · Feb 13, 2014

I will definitely try both.

The intercooler pipes did have oil in but it didn't seem excessive, just blow by i thought.

lpoolalan · Feb 13, 2014

Mine was causing a vacuum and sucking oil back out the sump into the turbo hence the smoke ect, before hand they had almost nothing in. well worth a spin without the filter in, could end up being a nice easy fix hopefully

m4drx · Feb 13, 2014

hopefully.

Appreciate you input bud. I've been racking my brain and the internet without success and this sounds like it fits.

lpoolalan · Feb 13, 2014

m4drx said:
hopefully.

Appreciate you input bud. I've been racking my brain and the internet without success and this sounds like it fits.

No problem, let me know how you get on. I remember thinking "this feels expensive" lol

Good luck

m4drx · Feb 13, 2014

right, I'm not sure if it's 100% but it's certainly better.

Whilst I'd previously changed the filter (with great difficulty). I hadn't removed the join between the flat plastic piece and the inlet to the snorkel air box. This time I removed the whole lot and realised that where I have what I believe to be a 300tdi snorkel fitted, the previous owner used a piece of plastic pipe to reach the extra distance back to the air box and it was just pushed too far into the flat plastic section restricting the air flow badly.

I'm still not happy that I've had to remove the rubber ring and metal plate from the air filter to fit it into the air box but I'll have to replace this with a filter that properly fits this air box.

I really need to drive a known well running 200tdi disco to compare as I don't know whether it still has an issue. It seemed to rev higher, to around 3600rpm before sounding/feeling like I shouldnt push it more.

sp00k · Feb 13, 2014

If it's any help, mine pulls all the way to 4000 RPM without hesitation. I don't like to drive like that but sometimes I have to as I only have a 1.6 box.

EDIT: It's a 200 TDI disco 1 engine in a defender.

m4drx · Feb 13, 2014

sp00k said:
If it's any help, mine pulls all the way to 4000 RPM without hesitation. I don't like to drive like that but sometimes I have to as I only have a 1.6 box.

EDIT: It's a 200 TDI disco 1 engine in a defender.

Mine is currently covered in mud and its dark so it's hard to see if there is any black smoke still but it certainly revs higher without too much problem. I tried it without the air box attached for comparison and it seemed to be the same now that I've fixed the restriction.

The boost from the turbo seems to run out pretty quickly, which isn't surprising really but it definitely felt like it was revving to 3500rpm with a fair amount of pull. After that it is rather flat and at about 3800, it doesn't want to go much more really. It feels like it's about right if i'm honest, i don't think they're really meant to be revved higher?

Certainly has more power and drives better which is good. Might try playing with the fuel pump adjustments i've been reading about. I could really do with someone with some more experience with these to give me their 2p after driving it.

m4drx · Feb 13, 2014

I don't know if the diff ratios have been changed at all but i changed out the transfer box to another stock 200tdi transfer last month and it drives the same.

I'm not experienced enough with these but I've heard of people changing ratios etc. No idea if anything like that has been done on mine. It had 33" mud tyres when I got it so I thought this was why it felt slow. It was the fact that it didn't want to pull past 3k that concerned me. Now that this seems resolved, I think it's ok.

It certainly doesn't hesitate/splutter or anything.

lpoolalan · Feb 13, 2014

Plenty of info on here about playing with the turbo and fueling ect, my old 200 gave up just before 4k aswel.

m4drx · Feb 13, 2014

lpoolalan said:
Plenty of info on here about playing with the turbo and fueling ect, my old 200 gave up just before 4k aswel.

i think that is about right to be honest. I may be able to improve power by fettling with the pump etc. but in all honestly, it's much better than it was and I'm not really in pursuit of power. I'd rather it just be running how it should. It's never going to be a fast car.

lpoolalan · Feb 13, 2014

Very true mate. Glad it's sorted anyway and it wasn't anything terminal

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