Colthebrummie
Well-Known Member
When mine became 40 years old, I mistakenly taxed it for 12 months, the DVLA wrote to me saying it was exempt and refunded the tax.
Col
Col
TheMegaMan
Well-Known Member
This is interesting.
Mine was first registered in 1981 so I assumed I had a couple of years still to go, but I've recently discovered it was actually a 1978 build and lived in a quarry for the first few years of its life. So I think I'm going to need to apply for this, and can't expect anything to happen automatically for another few year.
It's SORN'ed at the moment as I'm rebuilding it, but it'll likely be mobile again early next year. I am putting everything on a new chassis, but it's a like-for-like Richards galvanised chassis, so from what I can see that doesn't count as a 'substantial change'. Engine, gearbox, axles and bodywork are all being carried over from the original.
So I guess I need to get a Heritage Certificate as proof of actual age/build date, but what else do I need to do? I assume at some point I need to contact the DLVA and inform them about the new chassis, anyway... Does the tax and MoT exemption come through the same channels, or do I need to apply for both independently?
Mine was first registered in 1981 so I assumed I had a couple of years still to go, but I've recently discovered it was actually a 1978 build and lived in a quarry for the first few years of its life. So I think I'm going to need to apply for this, and can't expect anything to happen automatically for another few year.
It's SORN'ed at the moment as I'm rebuilding it, but it'll likely be mobile again early next year. I am putting everything on a new chassis, but it's a like-for-like Richards galvanised chassis, so from what I can see that doesn't count as a 'substantial change'. Engine, gearbox, axles and bodywork are all being carried over from the original.
So I guess I need to get a Heritage Certificate as proof of actual age/build date, but what else do I need to do? I assume at some point I need to contact the DLVA and inform them about the new chassis, anyway... Does the tax and MoT exemption come through the same channels, or do I need to apply for both independently?
One last point. If you are rebuilding a Land Rover onto a new (standard) galvanised chassis, some people will tell you that you need to inform DVLA. DO NOT TELL THEM! There is no legal requirement to do so, and it just confuses the junior clerk on whose desk your notification lands. Mention the words 'chassis swap' to DVLA and you will be buried in paperwork from now to eternity. All you need to do is make sure you keep the receipt for the new chassis, and dispose of the old one in such a way that it cannot be reused. That is as far as you need to go.
This was copied and pasted from Glencoyn's website.
As regards proof of build date I used Gaydon and got a cert from them stating where and when mine was built, apparently the DVLA will accept this as proof and I hope that's the case as I need to register my series 3 ex mil when its back on the road.
When you register it you have to tax it at the same time so all the rest should follow automatically (hopefully!).
This was copied and pasted from Glencoyn's website.
As regards proof of build date I used Gaydon and got a cert from them stating where and when mine was built, apparently the DVLA will accept this as proof and I hope that's the case as I need to register my series 3 ex mil when its back on the road.
When you register it you have to tax it at the same time so all the rest should follow automatically (hopefully!).
TheMegaMan
Well-Known Member
OK, good advice. Thanks.
Just to be clear, the key is that the vehicle tax class on the V5 and in the DVLA data base gets changed from "PLG" to "historic". That then unlocks all sorts of things like some emission zone exemptions. "Historic" class vehiles still require annual tax but it is currently priced at £0. Don't expect that to last but so far so good, I suspect it will creep up to £5 once it looks like there are enough to make money for the DVLA. As a "historic" it is now also MOT exempt and legal to drive with black and silver number plates ( a recent change). Its looking like the DVLA may be automatically applying the "historc" status where they have date, but some vehiles such as ex-army need a build date as the reg date is typically 10 or so years later and the "historic" is build date. Since the change is made by the DVLA you should get a new V5 free. So its not "tax exempt", its taxed at £0 which is different, you could in theory still be prosecuted for no road tax, although its hard to see how or why.since applying for it is so easy.
Webley1991
Well-Known Member
I did the MOT exemption when I last taxed my exempt 1972 Series 3. All it was is a single page form.
The form had a list of vehicle categories with tick boxes for the type of vehicle it was. All you had to do is tick the correct box, sign the form and hand it back to the clerk.
I took my V5 with me just in case they asked to see it, but as far as I can remember they did not.
The form had a list of vehicle categories with tick boxes for the type of vehicle it was. All you had to do is tick the correct box, sign the form and hand it back to the clerk.
I took my V5 with me just in case they asked to see it, but as far as I can remember they did not.
6pot
Well-Known Member
Some interesting discussion on this subject and particularly 'don't expect this to last' by rob1miles - I realise that remark relates to the historic tax being £0 but I felt that there was a possibility of the whole historic vehicle scheme coming to an end with a change of government, need to raise more tax, etc etc
SO, my experience of this is:- this summer I decided to get the Landy changed from PLG to Historic Vehicle in the hope that once it is done it is permanent and I was amazed at what a doddle it was, despite the fact that it hasn't turned a wheel for years and I had no V5. A bit annoyed that I had not got a new V5 sooner because applying for that with a form V62 has resulted in the date I acquired the vehicle being shown as this year rather than when I actually acquired it, depite the fact that I gave them the actual date and explained that the previous keeper had lost the V5, only recently I chased for it again, it's not been used on a public road during that time etc. I originally held off doing this because I wanted to work through enough stuff to be sure that it was not too much of a basket case to take responsibility for!
Anyway, that was easy, form V62, cheque for £25 and fingers crossed that the VIN was correct - stamped on the chassis but I had never found the VIN plate until one day I took the air filter out and there it was on the inside of the front panel, and it matched the chassis luckily.
When the new V5 arrived about 6 weeks later I took it to the post office with the tax class change section filled in, I put 'Historic Vehicle' and handed it over the counter, sligthly surprised that there is no need to date it and not even anywhere to sign it! The lady behind the counter took the V5 and issued me with a receipt for 1 years road fund licence at £0 on the spot. I had filled in a V112 for MOT exemption with the relevant category letter entered in the box as well and presented that with the V5 but was told that the post office does not need it and as she put it 'that is between you and the DVLA'.
About a month later the new V5 arrived a second time with the tax class changed to Historic Vehicle, job done.
I had read that historic vehicles are exempt from the London congestion charge, the low emission zone and the new ultra low emission zone due to be introduced which is handy because the ULEZ comes out as far as the north circular. Interesting to hear that a registered historic vehicle can also carry black/silver plates.
I posted the V112 separately to the DVLA anyway but I have not heard anything further. Currently the DVLA look up website shows it as taxed until Aug 2020 and MOT - no details returned, not sure if that will change. I was also advised to keep a signed copy of the V112 with me in the vehicle.
Overall though the whole process was amazingly easy and I could technically drive it now if I got it insured, except that I need to change the head gasket, oh and the petrol pump's knackered and the brake master cylinder needs new seals etc etc etc...
SO, my experience of this is:- this summer I decided to get the Landy changed from PLG to Historic Vehicle in the hope that once it is done it is permanent and I was amazed at what a doddle it was, despite the fact that it hasn't turned a wheel for years and I had no V5. A bit annoyed that I had not got a new V5 sooner because applying for that with a form V62 has resulted in the date I acquired the vehicle being shown as this year rather than when I actually acquired it, depite the fact that I gave them the actual date and explained that the previous keeper had lost the V5, only recently I chased for it again, it's not been used on a public road during that time etc. I originally held off doing this because I wanted to work through enough stuff to be sure that it was not too much of a basket case to take responsibility for!
Anyway, that was easy, form V62, cheque for £25 and fingers crossed that the VIN was correct - stamped on the chassis but I had never found the VIN plate until one day I took the air filter out and there it was on the inside of the front panel, and it matched the chassis luckily.
When the new V5 arrived about 6 weeks later I took it to the post office with the tax class change section filled in, I put 'Historic Vehicle' and handed it over the counter, sligthly surprised that there is no need to date it and not even anywhere to sign it! The lady behind the counter took the V5 and issued me with a receipt for 1 years road fund licence at £0 on the spot. I had filled in a V112 for MOT exemption with the relevant category letter entered in the box as well and presented that with the V5 but was told that the post office does not need it and as she put it 'that is between you and the DVLA'.
About a month later the new V5 arrived a second time with the tax class changed to Historic Vehicle, job done.
I had read that historic vehicles are exempt from the London congestion charge, the low emission zone and the new ultra low emission zone due to be introduced which is handy because the ULEZ comes out as far as the north circular. Interesting to hear that a registered historic vehicle can also carry black/silver plates.
I posted the V112 separately to the DVLA anyway but I have not heard anything further. Currently the DVLA look up website shows it as taxed until Aug 2020 and MOT - no details returned, not sure if that will change. I was also advised to keep a signed copy of the V112 with me in the vehicle.
Overall though the whole process was amazingly easy and I could technically drive it now if I got it insured, except that I need to change the head gasket, oh and the petrol pump's knackered and the brake master cylinder needs new seals etc etc etc...
Just a correction: historics are exempt the London Low Emission Zone (LEZ) but not the Congestion Charge or Ultra Low Emission Zone. (there are on-line vehicle checkers) The LEZ covers Greater London and is pretty much the whole of the inside of the M25. It doesn't apply to cars but catches a lot of Land Rovers because of the weight and tax class. I drove in the LEZ this week no problems, but the C-charge and ULEZ are another matter, they cover the same area but have different times (ULEZ is 24/7). The ULEZ looks set to be extended to the LEZ zone in 2021 which, if it goes ahead, will kill anything over a few years old.in any part of London. I think they have been able to pull off the ULEZ because there are few "normal" car owners in that zone (super rich don't care, everyone else just uses the tube) but that's not true of the planned expansion, it covers around 7m people, many nowhere near a tube, train or bus stop. I predict war. This could be a big vote issue, when Boris got in as Mayor he killed the extended C-change zone, it was just a tax in disguise. Expect Khan to get kicked out if he supports the ULEZ exstension as most people will have no option other than to drive and pay the charge.
I was living in Camden for a while, they brought in an "environmental charge" for residents to own a car "to cut carbon use". Where I was living the residents parking went from a 2 year waiting list to half empty, most people gave up owning a car. We were 5 mins from a tube and on a 24 hour bus route, but let's see how it goes in Bristol with no tube and limited buses. Already one own goal:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-50613971
Get your hi-viz ready!
I was living in Camden for a while, they brought in an "environmental charge" for residents to own a car "to cut carbon use". Where I was living the residents parking went from a 2 year waiting list to half empty, most people gave up owning a car. We were 5 mins from a tube and on a 24 hour bus route, but let's see how it goes in Bristol with no tube and limited buses. Already one own goal:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-50613971
Get your hi-viz ready!
6pot
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the correction, I was reading about exemptions on a TFL website (I think) many months ago and your description is not how I understood things, maybe because it's changed or maybe because I mis-understood what seem like quite complicated rules - I originally thought it sounded quite straight forward. I thought the LEZ was currently smaller than the proposed ULEZ, but again I may be out of date - I recall that LEZ signs are currently only visible from about Ferry Lane on the approach to London on the A13. If the LEZ and ULEZ will both be the same footprint out to the M25 at some point then that's pretty draconian, no wonder it's not being widely publicised as far as I can tell.
The O.H. is thinking of selling her gaff in Plaistow and I will have to use the Dartford crossing rather than avoiding it via the Blackwall tunnel which is currently the only other reason I drive that close to London.
The Bristol diesel ban article is interesting - something of a cock-up! Maybe it's just as well that I'm petrol powered as this type of thing becomes more widespread
I think it keeps changing, I went on the LEZ / ULEZ websites this week and I'm sure it was not the same as 6 months ago when I last looked. And yes its really confusing, took me a while to work out that you can esily end up paying both the ULEZ and the C-charge (about £23) for a single trip. i was looking for a page they had on modifying vehicles to meet the new requirments, that's all gone, it would seem a company set up to do this took quite a lot of money but the vehiles didn't meet the standard.
This used to have case studies for campers and vans, now it just says its not cost effective!
https://www.energysavingtrust.org.u...n-vehicle-retrofit-accreditation-scheme-cvras
This used to have case studies for campers and vans, now it just says its not cost effective!
https://www.energysavingtrust.org.u...n-vehicle-retrofit-accreditation-scheme-cvras
6pot
Well-Known Member
Hmmm sounds like a case of watch this space... and keep coming back to see what else has changed.
TheMegaMan
Well-Known Member
Replying to my own post...
Got a reply from the British Motor Industry Heritage Trust following placing an order for the certificate:
"Your Land Rover is a CKD (complete knock down), exported from the UK in component form and assembled overseas. As a result we do not have a build record for the vehicle and are unable to produce a Heritage Certificate." ...despite the chassis plate saying it was built in Solihul.
So I can't prove it was actually built in 1978/79 and I guess will have to wait another couple of years until the 40th anniversary of it's 1981 registration date comes around...
Bums!
Oh well.
Got a reply from the British Motor Industry Heritage Trust following placing an order for the certificate:
"Your Land Rover is a CKD (complete knock down), exported from the UK in component form and assembled overseas. As a result we do not have a build record for the vehicle and are unable to produce a Heritage Certificate." ...despite the chassis plate saying it was built in Solihul.
So I can't prove it was actually built in 1978/79 and I guess will have to wait another couple of years until the 40th anniversary of it's 1981 registration date comes around...
Bums!
Oh well.
At least you've got a bit more info about it though, do you know where it went to overseas?Replying to my own post...
Got a reply from the British Motor Industry Heritage Trust following placing an order for the certificate:
"Your Land Rover is a CKD (complete knock down), exported from the UK in component form and assembled overseas. As a result we do not have a build record for the vehicle and are unable to produce a Heritage Certificate." ...despite the chassis plate saying it was built in Solihul.
So I can't prove it was actually built in 1978/79 and I guess will have to wait another couple of years until the 40th anniversary of it's 1981 registration date comes around...
Bums!
Oh well.
Turboman
Mab An Gov
Mostly, but not quite right in a few details.
Historic vehicles registered properly as such are ULEZ exempt. I have checked the number plates of several Series over 40 years old on the TfL vehicle checker, and they attract no charge.
The ULEZ is being extended in October 2021, but not to the same area as the existing LEZ. It is being extended to the inner kerb line of the North and South Circular Roads, all the way round both.
There is nowhere within this area that is not within a ten minute walk of some kind of public transport.
The "super rich", are completely irrelevant. Many modern cars are compliant, Euro 6 diesels, which were made from about 2012, and many older petrol cars. Most Petrol engined Fords made after 2001 were compliant. And you can buy a 51 plate Focus for 500 quid and upwards.
The ULEZ impacts on very few private vehicles currently in use, except Defenders, and some other large cars and 4x4s fitted with diesel engines.
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Turboman
Mab An Gov
I would check that the details that DVLA hold are all correct first. The historics that I have checked are all petrol, because that is what we have.
I don't really know what goes on in the existing ULEZ, it is a very small area within central London, where I haven't driven in years.
The reason I have looked into this in such detail is that my parents live within the ULEZ when it is extended, so I needed to know what can go there. I will be selling my diesel Mondeo next year, and buying a compliant Focus. My wife's petrol Series is fine.
