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Hello, i have returned 🤟

There is a very big possibility that i will move out from my appartment and get a proper house with a garage and land :eek:

Ofcourse the first thing i think about is getting a Range Rover :vb-doh:

I had a very enjoyable experience with my 97 P38 2.5Diesel. (Easily my best car, ive owned 6 cars..)

However..

P38 or L322? :oops:

I have looked at a 3.6 TDV8 L322, i know of the turbo and EGR issues, but i suppose they arent a real issue as long as the EGR is cleaned/blinded....

Is it dumb to buy a 3.6TDV8 instead of 4.4?...

I will probably tow in the future, but nothing heavy duty i think.

My home-work drive is only a 10-15 minute drive, should i perhaps have a petrol instead by this reason? Thinking about the dpf...

I need a 4x4 due to the area the house is in, very steep hill. I am open for suggestions, i just have a sugar kick for landies...

I lowkey want a Defender also, but i guess this does not ride as well as a Rangie with air suspension.

cheers
 
Welcome back, It has been some time. So the P38 is gone now?

Personally I’d want the 4.4. It’s something to rave about not because it’s just more but I believe a better engine.
A defender is a defender but not refined like a RR. More stagecoach like compared to a p38. The l322 more refined again.
 
Is it dumb to buy a 3.6TDV8 instead of 4.4?...

I think the answer depends. If you can afford a a 4.4 TDV8 and get one of comparable spec/condition, then it makes no sense what so ever to go for the 3.6

The 4.4 has significantly more power and the 8 speed box makes a big difference to performance. They are genuinely rapid.

The 3.6 is a still good engine IMO and they go well too, but a reasonable rung down from what the 4.4 does. If you are seriously considering either, go and drive one of each and I'm sure you'll come to the same conclusion. If a 4.4 is realistically out of budget, then it isn't really a question as you'll only be looking at a 3.6 anyway.

However..

P38 or L322? :oops:
This would appear to be the 'bigger' question. And ultimately it'll come down to what you are wanting from the vehicle.

Dynamically the L322 is superior to the P38. They are more powerful, faster, better mpg and generally better specced.

But there is more to it when deciding.

As you've said 3.6 TDV8 you clearly aren't looking at early BMW based L322's. I forget the exact year they went Jaguar based with Terrain Response, etc. I think it was circa 2007/8. So any L322 you are likely considering is probably 16 years old at most and maybe younger.

With the P38 the youngest are now 23 years old with the early ones knocking on the door of 30 this year.

I think this makes a difference, as an older vehicle will need to be treated more akin to running a classic car, while I'd guess most people would still think of the L322 as a modern vehicle.

Personally I prefer the look and styling of the P38. I've never really got on with the muffin top overhang the L322 has around the waste line (window line). Its one of those things that once you've seen it, you can never really un-see it.

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Not saying the L322 looks bad, it doesn't. And on some AT's and lift they look pretty cool. But I do think the P38 has more classic lines and is more akin to the original. At a distance it can be quite easy to mix the outline of a p38 up with a classic.

Likewise on the inside. While the L322 is likely more plush and upmarket. I really don't like the German/BMW style of the interior. The P38 feels a lot more traditional British inside, in it design language and layout. I also think the quality of the interior of the p38 is actually very nice too.

But the real crux is how they feel. In an L322 you sit low inside with quite a high window line and a huge centre console making it feel as though you sit "in" it. Almost cockpit like and each front seat is quite isolated from the other people in the vehicle.

The p38 on the other hand you feel like you sit 'on' it and have what feels like a low window line and large glass area. More akin to the original Range Rover. It is open, bright and airy, while most L322s feel dark, confined and more cramped (some would say cosseting).

This extends to how they drive. While the L332 is surprisingly capable off road, although relying largely on its traction systems as they will lift wheels in the air rather a lot. They are a unibody or monocoque design with independent suspension all round. This makes them drive more "car" like on the road. To the extent that in many ways they feel rather a lot like a large heavy and tall estate car. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure an L322 is faster and flatter in the bends than a p38. But for me it is how they feel. The p38 doesn't drive like an estate car, it still feels like a "4x4" to drive, just a very pleasant, plush one that is comfortable and quiet. And for me this is one of the biggest aspects to the car. If I want something car like... I'd just buy a car! So I very much like my 4x4s to feel and drive like 4x4s.

In fact it is the same reason I'd opt (given I had the money, which I don't) for a new Grenadier over a new Defender. The Grenadier is a lot like the p38 to drive. While the new Defender feels like a heavy BMW 5 Series estate with more body roll.

The p38 wafts like nothing else bar maybe a nicely sorted classic Range Rover. The L322 is a different sort of vehicle all together, despite the name, styling and cross over of some abilities.

The L322 is also longer, wider and heavier than a p38. Not by huge amounts, but worth noting.


So for looks, ambience, feel and passion. The p38 is a clear winner for me.


The downside is, the p38 is older, so more age related issues. And as good as the p38 was when launched, there is no denying the 2.5TD BMW engine is a weak link. Fairly low power and performance. Even when remapped, often problematic and only moderate mpg. The Rover V8 is a much nicer engine being more refined, better sounding and better performing (even against a remapped diesel). But the downside is horrendous mpg by comparison. A p38 with something like the 3.6 TDV8 engine in would be an awesome vehicle...... if only someone did such a conversion. I know a few have done the BMW M57 3.0 diesel conversion.

The other downside with the p38 is you really do need to expect to have issues with it. It is that first generation of computers and electronics to be implemented into cars such as this. And it comes with its foibles. This isn't to say an L322 is plain sailing, they can throw a major wobbly too, but on the whole the electronics and EAS seem to much more sorted.

On a p38 many things can be fixed and solved at home, which is a plus. But you really do need to expect to have a never ending stream of things that require some sort of attention (small and large). Aka running a classic car.

Ultimately it has to come down to what you want or don't want from a vehicle and what you are prepared to live with. But only you can answer this. :)
 
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Personally I wouldn't touch an L322, it would be the easy to fix P38 every time.
Yeah but you got old and have lived your sense of adventure days.



Then you got wise :oops: .

We love our 4.4 TDV8 but wouldn't want to own it if all we did was short journeys, that could turn into issues. they need their legs stretched regularly.
The P38 is still a pleasure to drive.

J
 
Wow, alot of feedback here :cool:

Sadly yes, i had to get rid of my P38 @RangeRoller dt

I sure wish i hadnt

The reason i had to get rid of my P38 was due to not having space for it, it failed the MOT. As i have a full time job with currently 30min drive each way i am dependable on a car, so i bougth a disaster audi which got quickly replaced with a newer car.

I fixed king pins, radius bushes etc, had to calibrate the axle seal, but never got it right :( (it was the only hinder left!)

I changed the seal twice, it just kept getting eaten by the axle. It felt like the adjustment nut didnt adjust the hub/axle at all, i had other people who took a look at it, noooo idea. (I used a sledge dismantling the hub, dunno if i went to hard with it :p

Maybe the car i should go back to is the P38!
The only reason i got my mind into a L322 is the power and in my mind perhaps a more reliable engine due to its greater size and gearbox?

I think i will go for a P38 in the nearest future, if i actually do move out and get a garage.:vb-smile: It majorly depends on other bidders, it is upcoming next week!

If i move out, i wont be restricted to have 1 car either… i would have space for 20 :vb-party2:(2 stored properly in a garage)

I haf to say it, the P38 is the most comfortable car i’ve driven. - in my experience, people tend to like watching it on the road, a old beast!

I suppose a 2.5D without EGR wouldnt have to much of issues by majorly driving 15min drives? Or is it better to convert to Petrol?…

Cheers again, very hard to pick a Landie 🧐
 
I suppose a 2.5D without EGR wouldnt have to much of issues by majorly driving 15min drives? Or is it better to convert to Petrol?…

Cheers again, very hard to pick a Landie 🧐
The older BMW engine (M51 is it?) will be fine for short journeys. It is only modern diesels with dpf's that tend to have issues. Although if you keep an eye on the forum, you often see people saying about issues with the diesel. More so than with the V8 and I'm reasonably sure LR sold more V8's than diesels back in the day.

The V8 isn't immune to issues, but the Rover V8 has been around since the 1960s and was in production until after the p38 was replaced and must have been used in 30, 40 maybe even 50 different vehicles over the course of its production run.

The only real downside with the V8 is the mpg. Although typically I'd say a gently driven V8 should be in the range of 17-19mpg general use and dropping to 15'ish for more spirited or town use. Under the same use a diesel auto is probably low 20s and a manual a bit more. Sadly my 4.6 p38 likes a bit more of a drink and is kicking about the 13-14mpg mark. But it does have a few mods on it.

If you are only doing a few thousand miles a year, the fuel price difference will be only a tiny part of the running costs and not worth worrying about really. If you plan to do more like 10,000 miles a year, then fuel costs can make a huge difference.
 
My blue P38 did 20.9 on a run from Langley to Ferndown today, but does drop to around 15-16 around town. But it's only done 500 miles since have new Cam, Piston rings, Bearings, Valve re-lap & head skim, plus loads of other stuff, etc.

Green P38 with higher mileage (180000) engine gets about 19-20 on a run & 12-14 around town, but it could do with a basic rebuild.
 
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I do like the P38, I do like the 322. The electronics, rust and insurance would put me off the latter. I had one on the drive recently and was struck by the size difference.
 
The older BMW engine (M51 is it?)

yup the M51, its the one i had in my old p38.

I saw a p38 2.5dse on the market yesterday, but its gone now apparently, so i guess it might be a waiting game before i can get a p38 😬

Time will show.

I will probably buy a P38 as soon as i move out if theres one available.

I will also be in the market for perhaps a defender, a 90 or 110 with a bed would have been sick!
 
Wow, alot of feedback here :cool:

Sadly yes, i had to get rid of my P38 @RangeRoller dt

I sure wish i hadnt

The reason i had to get rid of my P38 was due to not having space for it, it failed the MOT. As i have a full time job with currently 30min drive each way i am dependable on a car, so i bougth a disaster audi which got quickly replaced with a newer car.

I fixed king pins, radius bushes etc, had to calibrate the axle seal, but never got it right :( (it was the only hinder left!)

I changed the seal twice, it just kept getting eaten by the axle. It felt like the adjustment nut didnt adjust the hub/axle at all, i had other people who took a look at it, noooo idea. (I used a sledge dismantling the hub, dunno if i went to hard with it :p

Maybe the car i should go back to is the P38!
The only reason i got my mind into a L322 is the power and in my mind perhaps a more reliable engine due to its greater size and gearbox?

I think i will go for a P38 in the nearest future, if i actually do move out and get a garage.:vb-smile: It majorly depends on other bidders, it is upcoming next week!

If i move out, i wont be restricted to have 1 car either… i would have space for 20 :vb-party2:(2 stored properly in a garage)

I haf to say it, the P38 is the most comfortable car i’ve driven. - in my experience, people tend to like watching it on the road, a old beast!

I suppose a 2.5D without EGR wouldnt have to much of issues by majorly driving 15min drives? Or is it better to convert to Petrol?…

Cheers again, very hard to pick a Landie 🧐
If you used a sledge hammer on the axle, for sure you bent it.
I find the seats park bench German hard in the L322.
The gearbox on the L322 with the M57 straight six is very poor.
No need to remove the EGR on the P38, just pull the vacuum actuator pipe.
The M51 in the P38 can be remapped for more power.
No DPF on the P38 diesel, so as long as you keep the battery charged, your 15 minute runs will be no problem.
 
Hello, i have returned 🤟

There is a very big possibility that i will move out from my appartment and get a proper house with a garage and land :eek:

Ofcourse the first thing i think about is getting a Range Rover :vb-doh:

I had a very enjoyable experience with my 97 P38 2.5Diesel. (Easily my best car, ive owned 6 cars..)

However..

P38 or L322? :oops:

I have looked at a 3.6 TDV8 L322, i know of the turbo and EGR issues, but i suppose they arent a real issue as long as the EGR is cleaned/blinded....

Is it dumb to buy a 3.6TDV8 instead of 4.4?...

I will probably tow in the future, but nothing heavy duty i think.

My home-work drive is only a 10-15 minute drive, should i perhaps have a petrol instead by this reason? Thinking about the dpf...

I need a 4x4 due to the area the house is in, very steep hill. I am open for suggestions, i just have a sugar kick for landies...

I lowkey want a Defender also, but i guess this does not ride as well as a Rangie with air suspension.

cheers

If finds allow, L322 with early infotainment system but Jag engine. If funds are tight, P38A every time.

Brake pipes will need doing on both. Quite possibly air-bags as well.
 

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