andybrown

andybrown

Member
Hi everyone,
I've a defender 110, 2005 and am having a Meyer drive pro snow plow fitted in September ready for the winter , but I'm unsure as to the best plan for suspension.

Some details; we live in Switzerland in the mountains. We run a guesthouse/restaurant and we have to keep the 3 mile track up to our place clear or snow from dec-April. We can get 20-50cm of snow in a day - the plow is for daily use to keep the worst of the snow away, but we do then have a snow blower on a farmers tractor that we can use to blow away the piles that build up! The plow is about 130kg, and will sometimes need to be driven while lifted at the start/end of snow season to avoid it digging into the gravel track. For plowing we will usually have an empty car but I can add some rear ballast. I need to avoid lifting the car too much as this will make the plow hard to fit/remove (2" is ok). We'll sometimes have a car full of supplies or guests, up to about 500kg to bring up the mountain.

What do you all think?...I guess standard suspension is fine for occasional use with plow usually in down position....but what about the times I drive with it partly lifted while plowing...or full with people!...HD suspension kit? But then I'm struggling when unloaded right?

Should I look at upgrading just front springs to HD? All springs? All suspension!?

Oh....and I'll most likely be using chains on all 4 corners ;-)

I know there is no perfect fit to my needs....but a best compromise would be great. Here's hoping you can help out a new fella on this forum ;-)

Andy
 
I think a decent HD kit should be fine. If the springs are properly made, the "hd" part of the coil should only come into use when loaded. Definitely worth a call to someone like Simmonites, who sell a lot of suspension parts.
 
problem you may have it that although its not actually all that heavy, that weight will be acting on quite a moment, so you might find its the dampers that will be swamped rather than the springs.

Alot of snow plows have little wheels which stop this happening so the weight is taken by them and you are effectively just pushing it along.
 
andybrown said:
Hi everyone,
I've a defender 110, 2005 and am having a Meyer drive pro snow plow fitted in September ready for the winter , but I'm unsure as to the best plan for suspension.

Some details; we live in Switzerland in the mountains. We run a guesthouse/restaurant and we have to keep the 3 mile track up to our place clear or snow from dec-April. We can get 20-50cm of snow in a day - the plow is for daily use to keep the worst of the snow away, but we do then have a snow blower on a farmers tractor that we can use to blow away the piles that build up! The plow is about 130kg, and will sometimes need to be driven while lifted at the start/end of snow season to avoid it digging into the gravel track. For plowing we will usually have an empty car but I can add some rear ballast. I need to avoid lifting the car too much as this will make the plow hard to fit/remove (2" is ok). We'll sometimes have a car full of supplies or guests, up to about 500kg to bring up the mountain.

What do you all think?...I guess standard suspension is fine for occasional use with plow usually in down position....but what about the times I drive with it partly lifted while plowing...or full with people!...HD suspension kit? But then I'm struggling when unloaded right?

Should I look at upgrading just front springs to HD? All springs? All suspension!?

Oh....and I'll most likely be using chains on all 4 corners ;-)

I know there is no perfect fit to my needs....but a best compromise would be great. Here's hoping you can help out a new fella on this forum ;-)

Andy
Click to expand...
The other issues you will have is the electric system. your stock alternator/battery will not put out enough juisce. a 120 amp alternator and a dual battery system with 1000/1100 amp batteries. Plus you will need about 500-700 lbs of added weight for traction. and your front suspension will need the heaviest springs/ and shocks you can fit
 
Thor1950 said:
The other issues you will have is the electric system. your stock alternator/battery will not put out enough juisce. a 120 amp alternator and a dual battery system with 1000/1100 amp batteries. Plus you will need about 500-700 lbs of added weight for traction. and your front suspension will need the heaviest springs/ and shocks you can fit
Click to expand...

what are you on about, hes doing 3 miles not clearing a whole town
 
Thanks for your comments so far. So maybe I should be looking at shocks and springs all round do we think? Can I get away with TF205 kit? As non Land Rover parts are these ok? Agreed that infact most of the time it will only be a momentary load, and once the track has snow bedded in/frozen underneath I will have no problem leaving it fully down most of the time.

I've not been instructed by my installer to worry about the battery....but i will certainly have my jump starter to hand this winter just incase, then I'll know for future years! I will monitor it's voltage.
 
with the heavy load setup itll be bloody horrible when empty. Been there... done that.

As its only going to be used for occasional use (one would imagine?) why not put up with it being a bit crappy with the plough fitted (but yourll be going very slow so who cares) and much better for the 99% of the rest of the time :)

if you want to put a lift on, put on lighter duty springs. Your spine with thank you for it.

you could get some air assistance spring things for when the plough is fitted. That way you have the best of both worlds.
 
Thanks vilguy. This was my worry. However as we are in the mountains, and at the same height as the ski resort on the other side of the valley...it's fair to say it will be more than occasional use. When snow comes...it comes! Our guests come on skis...and the track I will clear (leaving a snow base) is used as a long sledging path...loads of fun.

I'm happy to leave it how it is for now and see how we get on....but I don't want to kill the car in the process.
 
andybrown said:
Thanks for your comments so far. So maybe I should be looking at shocks and springs all round do we think? Can I get away with TF205 kit? As non Land Rover parts are these ok? Agreed that infact most of the time it will only be a momentary load, and once the track has snow bedded in/frozen underneath I will have no problem leaving it fully down most of the time.

I've not been instructed by my installer to worry about the battery....but i will certainly have my jump starter to hand this winter just incase, then I'll know for future years! I will monitor it's voltage.
Click to expand...
It is not the starting that is the issue. It is the lifting and turning the angle of the plow. It is a hydro turn? Go onto the ford.gm,dodge and see what the snow prep/plow package is to get better idea. also engine cooling can be a issue. I do have years of snow plowing experience
We get between 6'-10' of snow a year
 
From the meyers home page
Vehicles with Meyer Snow Plows installed may be so equipped as to meet vehicle manufacturers’ specifications and recommended options for snow plowing use. Most vehicle manufacturers insist that vehicles which are to be used for snow plowing be equipped with certain options and accessories, and it is so stated in vehicle manufacturer specifications for snow plow application. We also recommended that, for optimum performance, vehicles used for snow plowing be equipped with: • Four Wheel Drive • Minimum 60 Amp Alternator or Larger • Minimum 70 Battery of Larger (550 C.C.A.) • Mud and Snow Tires • Increased Radiator Cooling • Automatic Transmission • Power Brakes • Power Steering
 
well according to your copy and paste it has to be an automatic :p
Just because a manufacture recommends something doesnt mean it is a "necessity"

andybrown said:
Thanks vilguy. This was my worry. However as we are in the mountains, and at the same height as the ski resort on the other side of the valley...it's fair to say it will be more than occasional use. When snow comes...it comes! Our guests come on skis...and the track I will clear (leaving a snow base) is used as a long sledging path...loads of fun.

I'm happy to leave it how it is for now and see how we get on....but I don't want to kill the car in the process.
Click to expand...

In that case I would definetely look at the air "helper" springs. Put them in for the winter, remove them in the summer :) Perfect.

Thor1950 said:
It is not the starting that is the issue. It is the lifting and turning the angle of the plow. It is a hydro turn? Go onto the ford.gm,dodge and see what the snow prep/plow package is to get better idea. also engine cooling can be a issue. I do have years of snow plowing experience
We get between 6'-10' of snow a year
Click to expand...

ok so its running an electrically powered hydraulic pump then, so what, its just similar to running a winch. The defender oem battery and alternator will be just fine. The OP is only clearing a comparatively small area and thus it wont be used all that much.

I have many years of sound engineering knowledge :p and fit for purpose engineering understanding.

Itll be reet (as they say down here in Cumbria)

Think I will end up getting a plough for when we emigrate next year. Gets down to -30 quite often and loads of snow!
 
The unit seems to have a built in hydro lift/control, with a hydralic motor that runs off the vehicle electrics. Your existing alternator may cope for occasional use, but an uprated one, and matching battery would be better for more frequent use. Your standard 110 meets most of the standard requirements above, and even without increased cooling, was designed to cope with towing/working hard in hot weather.
 
Thanks... The battery is the standard 110ah, 800 cca. Voltage measures good. Yes it runs it's own hydraulics off the vehicles electric system. Do I really need to consider upgrading alternator?...hadn't thought of this.

Vilguy...what air helper springs are you referring to please? Sounds good.
 
andybrown said:
Thanks... The battery is the standard 110ah, 800 cca. Voltage measures good. Yes it runs it's own hydraulics off the vehicles electric system. Do I really need to consider upgrading alternator?...hadn't thought of this.
Click to expand...

I'm sure it will be fine, your only using it to do a few miles. "IF" you are finding its draining your battery, then consider upgrading to either a twin alternator set up (using 2 standard alternators) with twin batteries or a larger alternator (id do the twin one personally as if one fails you have a backup!) But I would only do this after testing the system out.

andybrown said:
Vilguy...what air helper springs are you referring to please? Sounds good.
Click to expand...

something like this

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Landrover...per-springs-/220586629499?hash=item335bfcd97b
 
The answer ( from someone with a plowing 110) is fit dual shock towers on the front and move your s/absorber to the outer bracket . Then you fit airide airbags inside the coils , when you have the plow on
put more air in the bags , when not deflate to 5 psi . With a 110 you should find that about 100kg in the rear will balance the plow well. depends a bit on what mount you have on front as some push the plow out more than others. Your standard electrical system wil cope perfectly well with running a electrohydraulic plow . You wont have headlights on when the plow is fitted as they will be behind the blade, you will have the plow lights , and possibly a beacon on top (Get a led one) . You also need a good reverse light flood (led again) . HTSH

ps dont go too fast too quick , and make sure you know where the edges are , also be very careful when running into deep snow that may have part thawed and then refrozen , as it can push you sideways very quickly , and if you are in a 22tonne plow
it can take some getting out :( .
 
tacr2man said:
The answer ( from someone with a plowing 110) is fit dual shock towers on the front and move your s/absorber to the outer bracket . Then you fit airide airbags inside the coils , when you have the plow on
put more air in the bags , when not deflate to 5 psi . With a 110 you should find that about 100kg in the rear will balance the plow well. depends a bit on what mount you have on front as some push the plow out more than others. Your standard electrical system wil cope perfectly well with running a electrohydraulic plow . You wont have headlights on when the plow is fitted as they will be behind the blade, you will have the plow lights , and possibly a beacon on top (Get a led one) . You also need a good reverse light flood (led again) . HTSH

ps dont go too fast too quick , and make sure you know where the edges are , also be very careful when running into deep snow that may have part thawed and then refrozen , as it can push you sideways very quickly , and if you are in a 22tonne plow
it can take some getting out :( .
Click to expand...
thanks for this idea and advice. Not sure I am kitted out for this kind of job, but maybe my local garage can help....problem is that it gets expensive doing this in Switzerland, so trying to find a cost effective option that will still work.
I've got suitable rods to mark the street that we'll install before the snow comes for winter. I hope to keep the snow level down to a manageable hight as I don't want to get thrown sideways... Never mind being pulled out....it would roll and roll and roll!
 
vilguy said:
I'm sure it will be fine, your only using it to do a few miles. "IF" you are finding its draining your battery, then consider upgrading to either a twin alternator set up (using 2 standard alternators) with twin batteries or a larger alternator (id do the twin one personally as if one fails you have a backup!) But I would only do this after testing the system out.



something like this

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Landrover...per-springs-/220586629499?hash=item335bfcd97b
Click to expand...
Ok, so I'm taking it all into consideration and seeing that this adjustable air system looks the way to go....with or without twin shocks. I will look into the alternator etc when it's fitted in September. I then have a couple of months to add this if necessary. As it gets so cold here (over night average -10 to -20) I feel I probably will need to upgrade this too.
 
andybrown said:
Ok, so I'm taking it all into consideration and seeing that this adjustable air system looks the way to go....with or without twin shocks. I will look into the alternator etc when it's fitted in September. I then have a couple of months to add this if necessary. As it gets so cold here (over night average -10 to -20) I feel I probably will need to upgrade this too.
Click to expand...

yourll need the twin shock towers for the front mate, your current dampers go right where the air bags would fit so you would need to relocate them to be located externally to the springs. Whilst your there you could upgrade to a big bore shock (terrafirma big bores are excellent, its what i have on my very heavily loaded csw and they cope fantastically) They are also pretty cheap ;) you should be able to get the twin shock tower and shocks for just over £200.

Does stuff have to be TUV approved (or the swiss equivalent)?
 
Thanks tacr2man & vilguy...so I think you guys are both in agreement on this then. Understanding the way this setup works now (newbie....sorry!) - yes it will need to be TUV Swiss equivalent approved and I'll need to show the modification to a test garage. I have a 4x4 specialist that is quite local who I will ask about this side of things to check it works with Swiss regs. This setup should be ok with authorities?

As a 2nd option; if I plan to use the defender for just the winter work, or to carry loads, am I right in thinking that going down the HD route with a 2" lift would be ok? Might make the car a winter worker and a summer camper.

Thanks guys.
 
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