Stanleysteamer

Well-Known Member
Full Member
Hi
Having had the usual problem, i.e. key won't turn in the ignition barrel or, if it does after a ton of in-out-in-out wiggle it about, I was reduced to leaving the key in all the time, covering it with a wash leather hung over the steering column. I used the other key to lock and unlock the car.
So, having read all the relevant threads, and also having removed ignition barrels in the past, I went for it with confidence.
Hmm!
Twas not as I expected!

Three crossheaded screws to get the bottom half of the steering column cowl was fine, with a magnet to get hold of the screws. Unclip the top from the bottom and at some point lower the fuse box cover by turning the two screws 90 degrees, no problem.
So far so good.
So, the security bolts. Hammer and screwdriver with an already bugred tip, knocked them round, no sweat, so off it came.
The three plugs all undid no problem either.

Took it in the house, unscrewed the two screws holding the electrical connection to the end of the assembly and removed it. Cut the cable tie holding the plug for the light that illuminates the thing around the keyhole. This gives access to the pin that hold the central part of the barrel into the outer bit. Excuse all the technical terms! I also needed to figure out how to get the plastic bit housing the circuitboard and the immobiliser coil off. In the end I pried up each clip but in fact all you need to do is rotate it a bit then pull.

I got organised and started trying to get the famous pin out of the side. Used my left hand drill bits, which normally do anything. But this time not as easy as it looked. Then, the blessed thing started turning in its hole. So drilling in a normal fashion was a waste of time. So I drilled at an angle and eventually was able to lever it out, with the far end still being viable, so set it aside for later.

At this point I expected to simply put the key in and pull the barrel out.
Wrong!

Although none of the other threads mentioned this, it is not possible for the simple reason that the barrel comes out of the opposite end to where one inserts the key. Which is a shame as that is the best way of keeping all the wafers or tumblers etc in place.
Here is where someone other than me would have found a bit of wire and threaded it through the hole from either end to hold everything in place, but that isn't macho is it? No! So I simply pulled the barrel gently out of its outer while trying to hold onto all the wafers at once. This worked but the ball bearing, despite my trying to ensure this didn't happen, fell out and rolled across the worktop!
So I thought, "Where has the spring gone?" as others have done.
So I packed up for the day and left it.

The following day I forensically searched the entire room for the spring. Did not find it. So, guess what folks? I am pretty sure there never was one.
So lesson learned, when taking the central barrel out, a/ use a piece of thin wire to keep the wafers more or less in place. Also, and if you can't be fu cked to do it the non-macho way, b/ do it over a towel or other absobent cloth so the ball, if you do not catch it, cannot roll too far.
The other point is that the tiny, tiny springs in the barrel are not very powerful, so if you turn the barrel so that the wafers are horizontal, as you take the barrel out, the wafers will come out a bit but they won't go too far and are very unlikely to go too far out and fall.
Thirdly (is it?) if you lose a wafer, do not have a heart attack about it. All you need to do is to take out the other wafer that slides next to it in the same section. and ensure both springs have gone too. If you leave the other one in it risks turning slightly sideways and causing jams etc. Then you'd be back to square one! The key will still work with a pair or even more wafers missing. (There is at least one wafer that sits on its own.)

Right, once you have got the barrel out and can insert the key, do so. You will find that some of the wafers don't move much and others do. The ones that don't move are not really a problem but it you want to extract them, use tape to hold the others in place. I used masking tape, tiny strips of. Then you may well find you need needle nose pliers and all sorts of other tools to gently extract the wafers as they are jammed in quite hard! Once out, rub them on a file to clean up the sides. Make sure you don't lose the tiny springs. You can then put them back in. They often won't seem to go in easily but once right in they move more easily. Tape them over and move on to the next if you need to. Remember, if you lose a pair it won't stop the key turning.

So now, with the key in, and pushed in as far as it will go, look at the wafers, both sides. you will probably see that, due to the key having got worn, some of the wafers have not descended right into the barrel to allow the barrel to turn easily in its housing. The normal advice here is to take a file or a grinder to the wafers in the barrel and grind them down until they are flush. But in fact, due to you having the correct key, albeit worn, you do not need to work too dramatically. All you need to do is to file the leading edge of the offending wafer(s) until they are down to the level of the barrel, at an angle. So that once the key turns the barrel in the housing, the wafer slides into place. We are only ever talking 10ths if not 100ths of a mm here.
When you come to replace the barrel in its housing you will find it a bit fiddly as the wafers will tend to stand up under spring power so you need to use all your fingers and little tools to push the wafers down into their slots. The ball bearing just sits in its hole.

The detents that hold the key in its various positions are in the switch part that contains all the electrical contacts, held in place with the two screws. To prove this to yourself, stick an appropriate screwdriver blade into the slot and turn it, you will feel it lock gently into each position. This is how you could drive the car if you had to, once you had got the immobiliser sorted out!

One other thing you will find is that when you want to put the barrel and it's housing into the outer housing you have have to mate the end of the barrel with the square hole that is connected to the spigot that goes into the electrical switchpart. But a spring to do with the steering column lock, keeps this square hole off to one side. The solution is to put the tip of a finger on the spigot and push hard, this for some reason centralises the whole thing with the square hole so that the square end of the barrel fits into it neatly.
Once in you have the problem of what to do about the pin, which keep the barrel in. In my case, having salvaged enough of it to work, I used a cable tie to hold one side of the top end of the pin in and then replaced the electrical plug in its normal place which requires another cable tie and holds the rest of the top of the pin in. If you have totally destroyed the pin you might want to find a 3.5mm drill bit end or summat similar to go in the hole, and lock the barrel into place. Some ingenuity may be required.

Beyond that reassembly is the reverse of dismantling, as usual. I would not lubricate anything as that is more likely to jam stuff up once the grease or whatever picks up gunk.
Sorry there are no pics. I was in two minds as to wheter to bother writing all this up, so never took any, and it is now all in the car and working fine. then i decided, "well, it caught me out and slowed me down, so why not?"

As for the ball bearing, I am not sure what purpose it serves, but I am aware that there is something in the lock mechanism that picks up the presence of the key, and when you insert this latter in the lok you push this ball bearing to one side as it enters. Secondly, I noted that the barrel will not turn until the key is pushed right into the barrel and then a bit further. So it may be something to do with this. I do not really know.
Hope this is of use to someone!
 
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I just used this write up i found somewhere the other year.

Never had a problem...:p.

Cheers
Yep, I found this and used it. And this is why I wrote this thread.
You, @neilly, may or may not be an experienced engineer and car wallah. Who can see your way around what, to you, are obvious problems and solve them. but I work from the basis that a lot of people who come on the forum are very amateur and feeling their way into fixing things themselves. So maybe I do patronise and state the apparently obvious. But if one person speeds their work up through having read this, then I will be happy.
Take from this what you like.
 
Yep, I found this and used it. And this is why I wrote this thread.
You, @neilly, may or may not be an experienced engineer and car wallah. Who can see your way around what, to you, are obvious problems and solve them. but I work from the basis that a lot of people who come on the forum are very amateur and feeling their way into fixing things themselves. So maybe I do patronise and state the apparently obvious. But if one person speeds their work up through having read this, then I will be happy.
Take from this what you like.

If it helps, it helps :)
 
Thats what I thort, and a few glasses of wine on a warm day...why not? (Stopped me having to go in a dark garage and find the Smoothrite and paint it on my towbar mount!)

Do it tomorrow cause it'll get cold on Sunday, mind it might have a thundershower Sat anorl ..
 
When i had the problem of my key getting harder and harder to remove from the ignition barrel in my Disco 1, i just bought a new one.
SO MUCH LESS FAFFING ABOUT!
 
When i had the problem of my key getting harder and harder to remove from the ignition barrel in my Disco 1, i just bought a new one.
SO MUCH LESS FAFFING ABOUT!
So you bought a new one and fitted it? If so, all you needed to do with the old one would have taken you about 5 minutes longer than what you did, AND you could have carried on using the original key. And you'd have saved money!:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:
 
Graphite powder ;)

Tits wot i used and it improved the key no end...
When I took mine apart, what surprised me was not so much the wafers that extended too far with the key in, due to the key being worn, but the wafers that were stuck in the down position, which didn't stop the key working but which I pulled out, using various tools and then "eased" by rubbing their sides on a file. Once reinstalled they functioned as they should.
It is such a dream having a key that works effortlessly.:)
 
I tried WD40 then white grease when mine started to get stuck in the barrel. Both worked for a short while but then less so and when it came to the point when it plain refused to come out, i ordered a new one.
 
Aaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh, you are making some assumptions here!
1. I know what i'm doing when it comes to ignition barrels.
I don't, but i can wield a centre punch and hammer!
2. I care about having a startit and gettin key.
I don't. Many of my cars in the past have had two keys.
3. I worry about saving money.
I don't. In fact i often worry if i haven't spent some on a car. Or tools. A man can NEVER have too many tools!
A couple of weeks ago i discovered there is 'sline' drive. In addition to multi hex and Torx. I don't have any on my car but bought a couple of sets covering all sizes. Just in case...
4. I didn't actually save money.
I did! Sort of...
When i ordered the barrel from a well known seller of Landy parts on ebay, (not being vague, just can't remember them) i ordered the fast post option as opposed to free post. It should have arrived on the monday. On the thursday night i emailed enquiring as to whether it had been despatched. I went to work on friday and he replied that yes it had and if i was desperate he'd send another one overnight.
By this point i'd managed to waggle it free and filled the barrel with more WD and it was releasing it with a bit of a wiggle.
When i got home he'd sent a second email. I replied to the first saying not to panic, i'd managed to get the barrel working again and i'd get in touch if it hadn't arrived by monday night as i have a habit of emailing sellers the day before the parcel arrives.
Then i read the second one telling me i'd have one with me saturday morning pre midday!
I thanked him.
Well, you can guess what happened on saturday morning...
TWO parcels! Both containing a new barrel...
OH BUGGER!!!
Now i'm sat at home thinking do i keep quiet about the first parcel arriving too or tell him?
I decided as he'd been so good as to send me a replacement overnight for a saturday delivery i'd email and tell him. I said i'd buy the second one too and keep it as a spare. He said no. Keep it for being understanding. I argued that it was his fault Postman Pat got stuck in second gear and that i was happy to buy two. He insisted that i keep both and have the second one free of charge. So i stopped arguing and thanked him and gave them glowing feedback!
I was pretty sure i'd have another Disco in the future so it wouldn't go to waste. That one was my second.
As it turned out it went to a mate whose own barrel started getting a bit grabby too.
 
Aaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh, you are making some assumptions here!
1. I know what i'm doing when it comes to ignition barrels.
I don't, but i can wield a centre punch and hammer!
2. I care about having a startit and gettin key.
I don't. Many of my cars in the past have had two keys.
3. I worry about saving money.
I don't. In fact i often worry if i haven't spent some on a car. Or tools. A man can NEVER have too many tools!
A couple of weeks ago i discovered there is 'sline' drive. In addition to multi hex and Torx. I don't have any on my car but bought a couple of sets covering all sizes. Just in case...
4. I didn't actually save money.
I did! Sort of...
When i ordered the barrel from a well known seller of Landy parts on ebay, (not being vague, just can't remember them) i ordered the fast post option as opposed to free post. It should have arrived on the monday. On the thursday night i emailed enquiring as to whether it had been despatched. I went to work on friday and he replied that yes it had and if i was desperate he'd send another one overnight.
By this point i'd managed to waggle it free and filled the barrel with more WD and it was releasing it with a bit of a wiggle.
When i got home he'd sent a second email. I replied to the first saying not to panic, i'd managed to get the barrel working again and i'd get in touch if it hadn't arrived by monday night as i have a habit of emailing sellers the day before the parcel arrives.
Then i read the second one telling me i'd have one with me saturday morning pre midday!
I thanked him.
Well, you can guess what happened on saturday morning...
TWO parcels! Both containing a new barrel...
OH BUGGER!!!
Now i'm sat at home thinking do i keep quiet about the first parcel arriving too or tell him?
I decided as he'd been so good as to send me a replacement overnight for a saturday delivery i'd email and tell him. I said i'd buy the second one too and keep it as a spare. He said no. Keep it for being understanding. I argued that it was his fault Postman Pat got stuck in second gear and that i was happy to buy two. He insisted that i keep both and have the second one free of charge. So i stopped arguing and thanked him and gave them glowing feedback!
I was pretty sure i'd have another Disco in the future so it wouldn't go to waste. That one was my second.
As it turned out it went to a mate whose own barrel started getting a bit grabby too.
I make few assumptions which is why, if I do an instructable I assume the person reading is a very basic mechanic. If I was to assume any other level of competence I would be cruising for a fall so I don't. so if anyone feels patronised I am sorry.
Secondly, I assume that the whole reason people are on here is to do their own mechanicking. OR because the mechanic they paid has fu cked up. Hence my desire to help save money. If you can afford to have someone else do the work, why be on here? And also if you can fix the bit you have, it is often quicker than waiting for the new bit to arrive.
Thirdly, my Disco one needed a new lock barrel so I ended up with three things on the key ring, a key for the doors, a fob to unlock and disarm the alarm immobiliser and a separate key for the ignition. This is a big awkward lump in the pocket. Compared to just the one key for the D2.

Sticking any sort of lube in a lock may free it off temporarily, but the lubrication will have a tendency to allow crud just generally floating around to stick to it which causes a/ wear and b/ sticking. So tis better to clean it off, ease it with a file if cleaning doesn't shift the sh!t and put it back together again. Brass against ally generally isn't a problem. I am very wary of lubing as I think about watchmending when working with locks, as they have tiny bits in them, are very precise and have very fine springs. In fact if I had to oil one I would use clock or watch oil. But this is probably what people need Amazon product
Anyway. sorry my thread has not been of any use to you.:(
 
I don't think i've ever read a patronising article on here. Yours wasn't, and my skillset is well beyond basic and i read your step by step guide with great interest. Personally, if something is buggered and cheap to replace i'll replace it. I don't have detailed knowledge of how the barrel works and for me it was just quicker and easier to replace it. My ethos is, if it's worn and you bodge it, chances are it'll only fail again later.
As for why i'm on here, it's to learn things i didn't know and share knowledge to others to help if i can
 
I don't think i've ever read a patronising article on here. Yours wasn't, and my skillset is well beyond basic and i read your step by step guide with great interest. Personally, if something is buggered and cheap to replace i'll replace it. I don't have detailed knowledge of how the barrel works and for me it was just quicker and easier to replace it. My ethos is, if it's worn and you bodge it, chances are it'll only fail again later.
As for why i'm on here, it's to learn things i didn't know and share knowledge to others to help if i can
Thank you for that.
Compensating for a worn key is going to need filing. This will make the wafers work in a lock barrel as they would with an unworn key. And the extra good thing is. if you ever do get a new, unworn key for the same barrel, it will still work fine. So I don't honestly think easing the edge of a wafer or two in a lock barrel is a bodge. The term "bodge" to my way of thinking implies a repair that will get you home but may fail in the near or not so near future. This repair will do neither of these things. so to me is not a bodge.
 

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