M

matn9111

New Member
hi
:confused: i have a 1997 4.6 v8 range rover, just when to start it after about a week and have a totally flat battery, not a problem i thought, key fob would not open the car so i used the key to open it. got it open and popped the hod, attached the jump leads went to turn her over and the alarm started going off. a massage came up that the engine was locked out!!!
i've got the code but the problem is cant charge the battery as the bonnet is open setting the alarm off, cant Put the code in with the key as the battery flat!!!!

WHAT TO DO???????????????????
 
This is a quirk in some of the P38s. How long have you had the car?

With engine lockout you will need to have it recoded by a machine. (Happened to me last year with a 4.0 V8 - without warning - battery was getting a bit slow, put new one in and nothing except all the warning lights. Carted off to local specialist and re-coded. However the one we had before was a 4.6. Had it 9 weeks, 6 of which were spent in the supplying garage, specialist auto electrician and main dealer. Three new batteries and never got to the bottom of it - took it back to selling dealer and got full refund. With any luck you have the first problem.
 
dont put anything on the battery neg terminal when jumping ever!!! the battery should come off the car to charge. this is quite important as it can destroy the electrofeckery bits in the car!!!

put the neg to the chassis.

you can, if you have sufficiant leads, put them up under the car and into engine bay and onto battery/chassis or you can put the + to the starter - to chassis. this allows you to get the code in the door as the bonnet will trigger the alarm/bonnet open sensor if the leads are poking out of the side of the bonnet.
 
gavbriggs said:
dont put anything on the battery neg terminal when jumping ever!!! the battery should come off the car to charge. this is quite important as it can destroy the electrofeckery bits in the car!!!

put the neg to the chassis.
Click to expand...

I am a bit confused.....
Are we talking about jump starting, charging the battery or changing it?
As the chassis is connected directly to the neg terminal, i cant see the difference. Also when changing the battery, surely a link battery has to be connected when changing the battery to keep the system 'live'?
 
Last edited:
The Mad Hat Man said:
I am a bit confused.....
Are we talking about jump starting, charging the battery or changing it?
As the chassis is connected directly to the neg terminal, i cant see the difference. Also when changing the battery, surely a link battery has to be connected when changing the battery to keep the system 'live'?
Click to expand...

dont question it, just accept that landrover spent lots of dosh working these things out.

its in the user manual so i assume they have thier reasons!:D:D:D:D
 
I always query landrover decisions - lets face it - they designed the gaylander. They arent always correct.
Yu still havent answered whether we are talking jump starting, charging or changing battery.
 
That just doesnt make sense. :confused: I aint disagreeing with ya - just cant understand why and if it cant be explained it smacks of witchcraft, not engineering. All engineering decisions must be based on sound reasons, not because " landrover sez so".
 
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Many years ago in college, (forgotten most of it) We were taught to attach the neg jump lead to the lift ring or other available neg point on the engine/chassis. But when charing to put the neg lead on the neg terminal on the battery.

When charging you do not use the car at all so the system is 12 volts.
When jumping its something to do with series and parallel. If you connect the jumping battery direct to vehicle battery the system becomes 24volts. If the jumping battery is earthed to different part of car it remains 12 volts.
I dont understand it either but that was what I was taught.
 
Khryztal said:
Many years ago in college, (forgotten most of it) We were taught to attach the neg jump lead to the lift ring or other available neg point on the engine/chassis. But when charing to put the neg lead on the neg terminal on the battery.
Click to expand...
Now that makes sense - when jump starting, you want the leads to be as close to the starter as possible, to remove any losses/high resistance joints, but when charging - you want to be as close (if not on) the battery for the same reasons. Hence my confusion - Also if connecting to change battery, I would have thought connecting to battery terminals was best, for the same reason.

Khryztal said:
When charging you do not use the car at all so the system is 12 volts.
When jumping its something to do with series and parallel. If you connect the jumping battery direct to vehicle battery the system becomes 24volts. If the jumping battery is earthed to different part of car it remains 12 volts.
Click to expand...
nope only if you put the two batteries one after the other, ie + to +, - to + and - to -. If yu connect + to + and - to - they remain 12V.


The only reason I can see is that a connection to the injun is less likely to be knocked off, but if it aint a proper earthing point then you stand to loose data, not if connected to battery terminal, and it still doesnt remove the problem from the + terminal.:confused:
Actually, I can remember another reason for not connecting the neg to to battery - summat to do with the fact that IF there is a load on the battery, then when the second lead is connected, then there is a likelyhood of a spark when the old battery is flat, and batteries give off hydrogen (booom!), however I would imagine that that is less of a problem with modern sealed batteries. I cant see how it can destroy electrickeries if you are connecting a battery on to a battery.
Charging may be another problem as, I assume, there will be some form of ripple on the charging voltage, which might damage ECU's etc, however Alternators can also put out an AC signal and I am surprised if the electronics on board is so delicate that it cant cope with any noise on the 12V line.

I wait a good reason why this is a problem when linking another battery to change the original.
 
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Interesting thread this - I remember seeing in the owners manual that when jump starting, you must connect the -ve lead to the chassis or somesuch but with no explanation.

I don't understand why and it bugs me. Surely if it were really that big a deal why didn't LR provide a suitable remote earth point to use?

Having said that, for some reason I have what appears to be a battery cable (complete with battery clamp) attached to the back of my aircon compressor just flapping around in the breeze. Perhaps this is supposed to be the jump start earth point?!

In any case, I don't remember reading anything about charging it this way. I've charged mine directly to the battery terminals without any problems.

Guy
 
i think its LR cover my ass policy!!

charging prolly wont hurt as there wont be much juice going in but when cranking theres alot of draw so i would imagine thats the reason. i don't get it myself but i do regualery use the chassis on most cars, mainly cos its easier in certain circumstances to attach to the body than battery, especially if your on a busy street with lots of parked cars!
 
Back to the original problem.
You will need to charge the battery, then, enter the eka code, and resynch the fob. Then open the car on the fob to disable the engine lock out.
It locked out due to being opened on the key, and you attempting to start with an unsynched key.
 
gavbriggs said:
dont put anything on the battery neg terminal when jumping ever!!!
Click to expand...

That is different between different engined P38's. On the diesel one it tells you to to connect the booster cables directly to the respective + and - terminals.

-Wills :)
 
I know if you have a knackerd battery on your vehicle its best to put the earth leed on the chassie and the live leed on the starter, you do with hgv's, thats what we have been doing for the last twenty years anyway
 
Khryztal said:
Many years ago in college, (forgotten most of it) We were taught to attach the neg jump lead to the lift ring or other available neg point on the engine/chassis. But when charing to put the neg lead on the neg terminal on the battery.

When charging you do not use the car at all so the system is 12 volts.
When jumping its something to do with series and parallel. If you connect the jumping battery direct to vehicle battery the system becomes 24volts. If the jumping battery is earthed to different part of car it remains 12 volts.
I dont understand it either but that was what I was taught.
Click to expand...

Jumping 2 batteries in parallel does not give you 24 volts. the reason L/R say put the neg to the chassis is to do with line impedance. The cables that supply the ECU's can be seen connected directly to the battery, if you connect a charger that is live or jump leads, it will cause a spark. This causes voltages spikes that can damage the ECU's:eek:. Conecting the neg to the engine or chassis gives a longer path to the battery which has the effect of reducing the level of the voltage spikes at the battery, thus protecting the ECU's to some extent:D

BULL**** BAFFLES BRAINS
 
Datatek said:
Jumping 2 batteries in parallel does not give you 24 volts. the reason L/R say put the neg to the chassis is to do with line impedance. The cables that supply the ECU's can be seen connected directly to the battery, if you connect a charger that is live or jump leads, it will cause a spark. This causes voltages spikes that can damage the ECU's:eek:. Conecting the neg to the engine or chassis gives a longer path to the battery which has the effect of reducing the level of the voltage spikes at the battery, thus protecting the ECU's to some extent:D

BULL**** BAFFLES BRAINS
Click to expand...

Ahhhh. An explanation at last!!

So it didn't occur to the geniouses that designed it all to filter the inputs then?! I expect that would have cost an extra 5p per vehicle or some equally terrible amount! :)

Guy
 
or for even less they can tell you to connect the earth to the chassis which you can imagine there are lots or places to connect to!
 
gavbriggs said:
or for even less they can tell you to connect the earth to the chassis which you can imagine there are lots or places to connect to!
Click to expand...

Good point. :D

My chassis is all undersealed/muddy etc though. It would make a rubbish electrical contact and I wouldn't want to scrape stuff off just for this even if my jump leads would fit, which they won't.

Guy
 
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