Hi All,

I’m have issues with the brakes on my year 2000 Freelander diesel. I’ve replaced the rear shoes and cylinders, front caliper pistons and seals and bled the brakes with new fluid but with the engine running I seem to have a spongy brake pedal. This is not the case if the engine is off? Pedal seems fine.

I should point out the brakes have been bled using a pressure bleeding device that I have used many times before with no issue. So far I have used nearly 2 Litres of fluid following the method described in the Rave manual but the issue remains. Driving the vehicle I find the brakes to be “weak” and uninspiring in their performance.

I have read much about bleeding the ABS system but if the primary circuit was devoid of air should the brakes not work as normal? Air only being an issue if the ABS was triggered.

If the ABS unit requires bleeding is it possible to do by bridging the pump relay (R173) and operating the pump while opening each bleed nipple in the correct sequence. I suspect it will not be that straight forward as I’m sure this will have been suggested many times before.

I’m hoping someone can suggest possible solutions to my braking issue or share ideas that I might pursue to fix the problem.

Many thanks in advance for any help offered.

Phil.

Hi Phil, is this and L Series?

I have had to do big bleeds on my L Series a number of times for front, back and modulator changes.

The biggest problems were when I changed the modulator. I had to remove the pipes on top of the modulator and inject fluid into the cavities with a syringe. However, this was because fluid refused to bleed through the system. It appeared by be getting sucked back up when the peddle was raised.

The next biggest bleed was when I replaced the rear brake components. I gave the whole system a big bleed, front and back. I was confident I'd pumped though enough fluid, but on giving it a test, the brakes were as you describe. I then gave it another big bleed all round and after that, the brakes were great.

I always use one of those "1 man bleed kits" - they are cheap and simple and work fantastic. Not that I have a pressure bleed kit, but I feel happier bleeding with the system doing the work as designed.

Another member over here has the same MY Freelander. He is a very proficient mechanic, much better than me. For some reason the brakes on his car do not work as well as those on mine. We've driven each other's cars and the brakes behave noticeably different. He has tried uprated discs and pads, but can't seem to get the system working fully.

I've not really helped you I know.

My only advice is that bleeding with a 1 man kit has given my motor good performing brakes, but it did take 2 big bleeds.

Hi, thank you for your reply.
I did crack open all 4 ports on the ABS block with pressure applied to the M/C and fluid did flow from these ports. I saw no evidence of any bubbles while doing this so I assume that part of the circuit to be OK.
I took the vehicle out for a drive today in the wet and try as I might I could not get the ABS to intervene when braking very hard, the brakes do feel as though air is in the system. All the required lights on the dash illuminate and extinguish as expected once the system check is completed....the TC light goes out when reaching the required speed.
I will try another full bleed when the rain stops to see if that makes any improvement.......not holding my breath though.
Regards.

Can anyone tell me if the
iCarsoft i930 Multi System Diagnostic Tool can operate the ABS unit for function tests on my vehicle: year 2000 L series diesel engine Freelander fitted with Wabco ABS unit.

Off the top of my head, I think not. But I may be wrong.

People use that type of function to bleed brakes, but I think you need one of the more expensive units.

If you suspect air in the modulator, then you can also use HDC to cycle some of the fluid about.
The HDC will pulse the brakes, then release the fluid back to the inlet port of the modulator, which helps shift air out the valves. You'll often need to bleed the brakes again after the HDC has done its thing.

Unfortunately the I930 doesn't do ABS activation for bleeding.
I've used my Delphi diagnostic for that, but not on the pre 2001MY FL1, which uses an older diagnostic protocol to the later FL1.

Nodge68, thank you for the info and suggestions, appreciated.

Well I tried the HDC trick today and can report after another full bleed of the brakes things are much improved. The pedal is now much better with engine running although not perfect yet ..... maybe more HDC cycling required.
The brakes in general are much improved but still on the weak side in my opinion, I cannot get the ABS to intervene under hard braking so I guess more work required.

philcbr said:

Well I tried the HDC trick today and can report after another full bleed of the brakes things are much improved. The pedal is now much better with engine running although not perfect yet ..... maybe more HDC cycling required.

Click to expand...

Cycling the HDC does help in clearing air from the system.

philcbr said:

The brakes in general are much improved but still on the weak side in my opinion, I cannot get the ABS to intervene under hard braking so I guess more work required

Click to expand...

It's not uncommon for the brakes to be so poor, that ABS doesn't come into play on dry roads. This is especially true for the pre 2001 models with smaller brakes.

Am I right in saying the bleeding sequence on the hippo is rectium for mamammary gland compared to normal cars? As in you start atthe front left, and work your way clockwise around the car?

Afternoon all .. does anybody want to explain the "cycling of the HDC " to me ... does this need to be done via a diagnostic machine ??

My brakes are fairly good till I get down to approx 5mph then peddle seems to go hard as if abs has kicked in orlack of vacuum...

Has been like this for a few years now and no issues with mot ..Have replaced nearly everything in system but nothing seems to improve that last bit of braking